May 08

Single father dilemma

There comes a time and age when a single man settles on the fact that the woman he ends up with will have a ready-made family for him. It’s the price we pay for showing up late to the ball; by the time single guy has defeated the work-force, made his bones, and decides on the whole nuclear family bit at 30+, his queen-to-be will have already danced the dance with another man. The bachelor accepts this, tries to look past it for love, and hopefully does a pretty damn good job of snapping into the role once they are married.

Now of course there are many single men who hold out of their Golden Pegasus with no kids, but these guys aren’t exactly successful when it comes to sealing the deal. Baggage has a lot more faces than merely having children with another man, and they find out harshly that the childless woman may be a big baby herself, looking for a “daddy” to buy her things. So men accept the fact that dating women of a certain age will result in children being almost a certainty, so they either date 19 yr old girls, or own up to the reality that their dating prospects will come with a child. Women can have a whole different mentality about this however

A list of dumb comments made by real women about single fathers…

“If you date a man with children, you can never expect to come first”

Oh grow the f*** up woman, what are you a 2 yr. old with the “coming first” bull? This sounds mad young to me, like something my nightmare of a 22 yr. old ex would cough up. Yet this comment right here is the leading excuse from women as to why they won’t give single dad a chance.

“No woman with an ounce of self respect is going to be happy in this situation”

I want to find this woman when she has a kid and her bitchy ways drives the dad away and she is out trying to look for a dude as a single mom. Just so I can flip the script on her and this bird caliber statement. Wow!

Now, there are some legitimate issues with dating a dude with kids that I can understand. First of all is the evil ex-wife who is the child’s mother, and then there are the dumbass dudes who try and force new-girlfriend to play mommy without any real introduction. There are many ways to say no to single-dad but the list of opinions above this paragraph just read as vile, disgusting and immature – yet I hear it all the time. Sadly it is the way that many single women feel, just ask a dad that’s trying to date.

So why the double standard? How come men are cool about rolling with the punches, dealing with the jackass baby’s father, and playing uncle to a woman’s seed yet the “fairer sex” are unapologetic harpies about it? Let me mess around and have a child whose mother dies, leaving me with sole custody and I know for damn sure that a good percentage of women out there would not even ask about her let alone attempt to date me. 

Single dads I want to hear from you about this bull… are you restricted to dating single moms now, or have you had any luck with childless 30+ woman? I have one homeboy who dates plenty, but the women he talks to almost always have a child of their own. Why is it this way fellas? Are women really this self-centered even when children are involved, or is it one of those femme rivalry things where they want to be the one and only mother in your life?

See some words or phrases that you don't understand? Check out The Dragon's Lexicon.
  • Pingback: Dating Do or Don’t: Dating Someone with a Child « From Ashy to Classy()

  • Wow. You’ve got problems. Maybe you give up your standards out of desperation, but don’t assume that women who don’t do the same have some kind of personal fault to blame.
    Yeah, if I’m in a relationship with a guy, a serious, monogamous one, I expect to come first just as he’d be first to me. Why in the word should I ever want to abandon all self-respect and resign myself to being second-place? Maybe you would resign yourself to less, but I wouldn’t want to be in a relationship that didn’t satisfy me 100%. Yeah, it turns out exclusivity in a relationship is a serious and perfectly legitimate concern, especially for women who flat out never want kids at all. It’s more-or-less understood that parents are a package deal, and children are WAY more significant baggage than most anything else a prospective partner can possibly carry. Not every single, non-childed person wants to put themselves through that.
    What gets me is that you’re complaining about a completely non-existent double-standard. Yeah, it turns out, there are plenty of guys who know themselves well enough to know that they would never want to date a single-mom, and so they don’t. There are just as many men in just this sort of category as there are women. Likewise, there are people in both genders who will accept single parents. There is NO double-standard. Maybe you should pull your head out and look around.
    Did it occur to you that maybe the real problem is that you, and other’s like you, both parents and non, are nasty misogynists with the attitude that no women’s dating preferences are legitimate and that they owe you’re their time and attention is the real problem? It’s amazing that you could carry this attitude that you deserve any woman you look at, regardless of she wants, and still have the nerve to accuse women of being selfish for being disinterested.
    If you’re a single parent, just accept the fact that your dating pool has changed significantly. Don’t get bitter over it, just get over it. You know, like an adult.  

    • I typically steer clear of Misogyny accusations but for Julia and anyone else who thinks that we steamroll women on this site, I offer the counterpoint which rips men through this former article:

      The point of this article was to bring attention to the men who are good single fathers who are continuously dissed throughout the dating world without the privilege of saying anything about it. Men have just about as much issues with raising children as women but are never recognized for this struggle. If this makes me a misogynist, then I’ll proudly wear that crown but I suspect that if we were to start tossing out labels you would be striped from head to toe (I saw your blog).

      Thanks for reading.

    • detwo313

      Wow Julie you are really looking at things from a Selfish standpoint, and to think that you have every reason to be that way. If you look at your life( please don’t take this personal), but at some point in your life someone has been selfless in order for you and others to benefit. I’m not saying that its anything wrong with a women preferring a man without kids at all.You think because you are married and/or have kids with you partner doesn’t mean a man won’t treasure his kids over his spouse. If you’ve never been exposed or heard about these sort of situations then I understand your logic. It seems like you’ve either experienced relationship with someone with kids, or sheerly from ignorance have perceived that thats the gist of relationships with men with kid(s). Sorry to say but I don’t think one person is ever 100% number one in anyones life it jus wouldnt be possible because you have strong bonds with other people before your were married. You seem like a childish lover and a mature man /father would not deal with your shennanigans (lol).

  • I don’t know why you bother to lie about the contents of an article that can be, and was, read. The article isn’t about single dads being disrespected for being single dads, and had nothing at all to do with recognition of their struggles in that role. This was a blatant attack piece on women who know they don’t want to date single dads. Are you really going to tell me that you have nothing at all that you look for in a partner? Will you just date whoever asks regardless of their gender, fitness, financial stability, mental health, career, diet, or interests? I doubt it. Why should my standards be called selfish, and not ever single other one that a person can possibly ever have?
    I understand that rejection must hurt and that finding a compatible partner in a dating pool that is severely limited by the parenting lifestyle must be frustrating. But that does not excuse your cruel and hateful remarks about women who aren’t interested. That was just childish, and, yes, misogynistic. To me, misogyny is a much bigger deal-breaker than being a dad. 

    • No, I think that like many women you are misusing misogyny to mean something a man says to make YOU personally upset, not ALL women.

      You are correct about my aggressive stance on this article being heavy compared to the one I linked, but the fact of the matter is that unless you are sympathetic to a single father’s plight this will only seem like an unfair attack on the princesses oops I mean women who choose not to date them.

      I am not saying that all women should date single fathers, but the ones who have should not have to feel stupid for doing so. Some have nightmarish experiences, some have great ones… it’s all in the game.

      Women continuously attack single dads, short men, broke men, and more without anybody defending these guys so I wrote an article to say “hey, get off of single dad, that’s not cool!”

      Personally I am childless but I can recognize a huge double standard when I see one and someone posting “No woman with an ounce of self respect is going to be happy in this situation” is just ridiculous given that if a man were to flip it and post it he would be labeled a misogynist instantly.

      You’re allowed to have standards but there’s a very thick line between crass and classy. I would never date a selfish, inconsiderate woman, but you don’t see me posting that guys that do are complete idiots. Don’t quote me on that.

  • “but I wouldn’t want to be in a relationship that didn’t satisfy me 100%.” You can try all you want but you are lieing your incredibly lucky if you can find a dude to be a relationship with that is gonna give you 100% satisfaction.

    The article isn’t saying woman complaining about not being #1 should settle for being #2, it’s saying they shouldn’t be thinking about #1 at all, because that is some trivial shit. You can’t be #1 all the time. The kids can’t be #1 all the time either. That’s why you get a babysitter when you want to go on a date. Its about time management and respect. 100% satisfaction comes from finding a good partner and being humble. No one is above one another, but kids need parents first, they can’t be patient like a grown adult should be.

  • Princess? A princess for having relationship standards or for calling you out on a blatant attack against women who have such standards? Spoken like a true misogynist either way. Funny how misogynists always rejected the label, misogynist, then trivialize the accusation altogether as if misogyny shouldn’t even be an offense worthy of criticism. No. What you wrote was an attack on women for having dating preferences other than what you think they ought to be, going so far as to call such women selfish, as if we owe ourselves to whoever happens to ask. That IS misogynist. Rather than taking the defensive, knee-jerk response of “nuh-uh,” stop and re-read what you wrote and think. Take the accusation seriously and honestly re-evaluate your thoughts on the matter. If you still seriously can’t find what you’ve written to be just a teeny bit sexist, then there is no hope for you.
    The irony is indeed that while here, in the comments, you make claims that single dads are under attack, your entire article is an attack on women for nothing more than their personal dating presences. The real attack is committed by you, but you refuse to acknowledge that. Why should an adult find it so hard to admit fault, so hard to take correction, and so hard to learn from their mistakes?
    You keep talking about attacks on single dads in the comments, but you didn’t mention a single one in your actual article. Having dating standards that simply do not include single dads is not an attack on single dads, and it’s ridiculous to pretend otherwise. Incidentally, since you brought it up, I don’t think that I would date a broke man either. I would want a man who is at least as financially stable as I am as I simply am not interested in taking on an adult dependant, nor could I afford to. That’s not an attack on broke men either. True, some women aren’t attracted to short men. So what? People can’t much help what physical qualities they do and don’t find attractive. What good would it do someone to be in a dating relationship with someone they just don’t find attractive? It’s not fair to call that an attack on short men either. I’m quite short myself. I’m not offended when guys aren’t interested in short women. Part of being an ADULT when it comes to dating is realize that you aren’t the only one with criteria for what you look for, but other people  have their own as well, which might disqualify you.
    You didn’t provide any context at all for the quotes you provided in the article, as far as I can tell. It’s not even clear if both quotes are part of the same comment or even written by the same person at all. As for the second quote, the one you repeated in your comment, there is no context as to what specific situation is being described. I think you mean for me to assume that the situation is any childless woman dating a man with kids, or perhaps it’s meant to relate to the first quote and is meant to mean the situation of being second place. Could it not also mean abandoning a standard and dating someone who you know is a bad match? I certainly could not be happy in such a situation, if that was the case. If you’re going to use a quote to promote a point, you must provide proper context.
    Now in your comment, you’re suddenly claiming that you’re defending women who date single men from unwarranted attacks from other women. That’s very interesting, as you never said anything remotely along those lines in your actual article. But I’ll go ahead and give you your argument. I’ll pretend that really was the point of your article, and that the quote you provided was a legitimate example. Do you seriously think that there is any significant population of women who go out of their way to personal criticize any other woman who happens to date dads? Yeah, no. It turns out that women who date single dads aren’t under attack either.
    With that out of the way, I’m wondering what new thing you’ll insist that the article was really about with your next comment.
    As long as I’m musing, I’ve noticed something that I hadn’t at the time that I made my original comment. I have indeed discovered a real double-standard, but it’s not the one you claim. Why should it be OK for single parents to prefer to date childless people, but not OK for childless people to do the same? That’s the real double-standard If, in actuality, single parents don’t have a preference for childless people anyway, then why should it matter if childless people are less likely to want to date them? In the article, the phrase “Golden Pegasus with no kids” was used, which I assume is intended to imply that childless people of X age are a rarity. If childless people are so rare, why don’t parents set their sightss on other single parents, just as you insist us supposedly rare childless people do? (Double-standard)
    And if childless people are so rare, how are our dating preferences of any significance to anyone anyway as there are, as you imply, so few of us? Obviously, there can’t be too few childless folks, as you insist that childless men must set their sights on single parents, but then moan that childless women don’t do the same, but as you do so, you admit that there ARE childless people of both genders and so neither set really needs to give up on finding a childless partner if that’s what they prefer.
    The more anyone investigates the article, the less sense it makes.
    By the way, you earlier mentioned having read my blog and that you could possibly find something to say about me based on what I’ve written there. I’m a bit disappointed that you haven’t yet done so. Really, I was waiting on some clever criticism; else why even mention my blog at all? Not that I believe that I’ve, as of yet, written anything of relevance to the discussion here, besides once mentioning in passing on one of my posts that I do not date people with kids.

    • This is my last point on this topic; i’m a bit bored… I know, I know… VERRRY adult right? Well let me be childish a bit; shout something at you; then take my ball and go home to mom.

      Misogyny is the hate of women, not the hate of Julie and women like her. Warp the word as much as you wish but educated men will not let you use it for your own attacks. What if I went around calling random women misandrists just to look like a victim? I think it would make me quite pathetic.

      Most of what I write here can show and prove that I don’t hate women… but that’s not what this is about is it? This is about me hurting your feelings because you have probably said one of the 2 things I quoted in the past and hate the replies that I posted for it.

      Let’s don’t pretend that you’re championing single women with your replies and keep it 100, YOU are offended and I am being labeled a misogynist for it. Being that as it may, I do not apologize for writing this piece; like it or not there is a double standard when it comes to single dads.

  • Ageless Wonder

    Okay I have to jump in on this post. First off I am a single dad who is actively dating. Through the myriad of dating websites, meet n greets, bar scenes, and coffee meet-ups, I believe it is ridiculus how men are treated the moment a child is mentioned. Being that you do not have children (from the sound of it) you seem like the person that certainly treats them as a burden. I feel he is pointing out the selfish women out there because their point of view is clouded by this belief that they won’t matter in the relationship.

    I grew up having a single mother my whole life so I have high regard for those that do it on a daily basis. It’s quite silly for someone to put themselves up on this “magical pedestal” without going through the experience as a parent. There is nothing wrong with having your own set of standards when seeking relationship “qualities”. I mean really is having a child considered a measure of quality? If anything a well kept parent is a head strong individual. They are the ones that keep their finances in order, they put another person before themselves, and quite honestly they do not put up with bullshit. But the biggest quality a of good single parent is they are not selfish.

    “Selfishness” is someone who puts their own needs before someone else and while people in general tend to abuse this quality, people in relationships sometimes forget this. Especially if they have been in many bad relationships. My arguement hear is not to shoot down the angry women of the world, but to understand why is dating a respectable “gentlemen” cannon fodder for single, parentless woman. Your rationale about single parents is a bit skewed. I have dated individuals on both facets (with/without children) and I can tell you dear that choosey women are going to be choosey women.

    To give you an example of a recent encounter… I recieved contact from a dating site that I am actively on. Now mind you I have pics with me and my little one, descriptions on my involvement with my child etc. We exchanged several messages back and forth expressing our interests in one another and it was at the level past “ice breaking”. The moment I mention my child she was immediately floored and said she was not interested. Was it her fault for engaging in the interaction without really reading my profile? Maybe. Her expression of the qualities she sought were not because I wouldn’t potentially devote all of my time to her. No it was because she wanted to have children of her own one day and wanted to go through the experience of new parenthood. And I can certainly respect that.

    People will tend to reserve their judgement and focus on the wrong part of an arguement. In the end it is an opinion. But I feel you are going about this feminist diatribe without a sense of being able to relate to the topic. In the end we get it, single parent dads are not your thing, but to inaccurately describe in that manner is highly uncivilized.

    • Jane

      It isn’t about being first or being second. Single women with no kids has never experienced mother natures most wonderous gifts -child birth. They never experienced havina baby of their own held in their arms.

      As a single woman i want to be able to experience that with someone that is on the same boat as me. I want to grow old with that person with MY OWN child in my arms and by my side. When a single father approaches me, i’m sorry, there will be a red flag.
      I would wonder:

      How did he become single dad? Did he cheat on his wife? Had this child out of wedlock? What made the “love” gone sour? It immediatly sends a “trust” issue into my head. Should i trust this men? Is he just looking to date me to have a “mother figure”? does he want me to be the “sexual pleasure young wife to mess around with?”

      These are the thoughts that comes up through alot of single womans mind when they encounter a single dad. That men can make up stories to even out the anxiety and hide the truth so that is another trust issue we single woman have to face.

      Ladies, face up to the facts! Single dads can be a definte turn off (at least, at first site)! We all want to be able to have our own children, experience walking down the isle. Don’t we?

      • Sugar

        In my experience as a single child-free woman, I have had a harder time dating than a single father. There appears to be more assumptions about single child-free women than single dads. But those thoughts of a single father do run through my mind sometimes.

      • Sugarfree

        “In my experience as a single child-free woman, I have had a harder time dating than a single father.”

        Were you a single father in a former life Sugar? Cause I wonder how you assume your singlehood is somehow worse than theirs.

  • Ageless Wonder

    And by the way I have dated both single parents and “childless” women. Though single moms are more related able date-wise, I do not have a preference. Hit me up sometime Julia???? ^_^

  • Annie

    I have to agree with Julia. In my opinion, there is no double-standard here. There are plenty of childless women that date men with kids and vice versa. However, I do believe it’s more obvious when a man dates a woman with kids because most women are primary caregivers vs. men.

    Having said that, I don’t think that childless women (or men) should be considered selfish just because they choose not to date someone with kids. Children are wonderful, precious, fun, etc… but for someone with no children, having them in your relationship is a big, BIG deal. It’s not like making a little concession by dating someone shorter when you prefer someone taller. Or, dating someone who prefers going to the opera when you “prefer” the pub for entertainment. Children are living, breathing, talking, eating people that can make a relationship more complex than if you both had no kids. They require time, attention, and money. Anyone who is parenting correctly will be responsible to provide those things. However someone expecting or acting like a childless person is selfish because they don’t want this complexity in their relationship, is, in my opinion very selfish and a bit delusional. If a childless person chooses to be in a relationship with a parent, GREAT. Many of these pairings happen everyday all day. But, if a childless woman (or man) has already done the assessment and come to the conclusion that this is more than they are willing to handle, it’s not selfish. They are just honest and know what they “prefer” in a mate.

    • GREAT response, frankly the “selfish” person is the author of this. So because a woman is thinking about the potential impacts to herself both emotionally and financially if she gets involved with this man she is selfish? Yeah, then let me be selfish. I dated a man with kids once and after the third date he cancelled because of the kids of something with his ex-wife I was done. In the courting phase sorry, I want to be #1 if that makes me “selfish” so be it. I don’t have kids and don’t want any of my own.

      Furthermore, men do this to single mothers’ ALL THE TIME! So stop kvetching and date a fellow single parent. Makes more sense anyway.

      • McThick

        So…a Dad dropped you for his kids? This surprised you? Biology dictates that kids win, every time. People go to jail, people DIE for their kids, and you get bent out of shape because a date got cancelled? Grow up and realize that you will NEVER be the center of anyone’s universe but your own.

        You’re right, you’re not selfish, you’re stupid. You knew the man had kids and still went into the relationship. You know what that means, but did it anyway, and then got pissed when what you knew was going to happen, happened.

      • You are clearly an idiot that likes to throw insults. I realized that being 4th on his list was not for me and I bounced. You grow up.

      • Annie

        Isn’t it funny that people with children always want to ,make a childless person who doesn’t want to take on a person with kids, out to be selfish?

        It’s also funny that many people with kids want to date someone without children because they recognize that children complicate a relationship.

        Yet…a childless person who doesn’t want to date them is selfish. Hmmm…interesting.

      • MRA Tony

        “It’s also funny that many people with kids want to date someone without children because they recognize that children complicate a relationship.”

        Where are you getting this from? Did you even read the article or you just another young girl with hamster tendencies? Do you know McThick’s life to even go in on “people with kids”? You sound very naive and simple.

      • Annie

        Excuse, me….did you read my both my comments?

        I’m not “going in” on Mr. Thick. My response was directly to EB’s comments. And, very much in context to the article. So who sounds simple now?

        “Reading is fundamental” and comprehension is king.

      • Coracreates

        I disagree with every statement here.

      • Ashley

        Your post proved her point exactly!!! THIS is the exact reason why childless people don’t want to date those with kids! You have other priorities. Completely unbalanced and eventually unfair relationship. Accept responsibility for your actions. You had kids…. They are blessing. But in no way, shape, or form are you entitled to be with someone without kids. That’s their choice and it is completely understandable. Get over yourself and find another single parent.

    • notasinglefather

      I don’t see how it is a man’s fault for being born short vs being born tall, nor do I see how it is acceptable to judge who you date based on that. Who you date should be based on love and a connection, not superficial shallow traits.
      You sound like a terrible person. I will pray for you

      • Annie

        Pray for me? Hunnee, pray for yourself. Clearly, you need to add basic comprehension skills and freedom from being naive to that prayer list.

        I’ll give you that choosing a mate should be based on love and connection, and not superficial shallow traits. But, guess what? It’s NOT most of the time.

        Also, I am not judging short or tall men. Where did you get that? My point was that childless women (and men) shouldn’t be judged for choosing not to date people with kids. It comes down to their fundamental right to have preferences and go after what they desire in a mate. Kids are a game changer in a relationship –especially, if they aren’t yours.

        And since I’m a terrible person, I’ll just tell you what I really think about you too. You sound like a F-O-O-L.

  • Please check out this wonderful article (by a woman) about the neglect that society has in acknowledging men in their roles as fathers.

    From the article: “We’re always begging men to step up, complaining about the prevalence of deadbeat, absentee fathers. There are plenty of them; but when there are men who are stepping up, are taking the initiative to care for their children, just like women have been and continue to do, let’s not look down on them or judge them unfairly because of it. “

    • Coracreates

      Good point. If we could all stop being so judgmental that would be a great start. 🙂

  • As a childless woman who also happens to have divorced parents, I don’t date men with children because I think of them as men who have abandoned their families. A father isn’t “stepping up” by paying child support and carving out time with his kid while pursuing dates. A father is home with his kids, demonstrating love through his relationship with their mother. It pains me when supposed adults (men and women) create innocent people and then wreck their little lives through their own selfishness.

    As for your example of having a child and then the wife dying, that is probably the only single dad I would consider dating. If the child’s mom is alive, I would constantly wonder why he isn’t with her. I know that even if I refuse to date a guy, it doesn’t mean he would go back to his child’s mother – but I don’t want to be the reason he stays away, either.

    Then there’s the part about being a caring person. If a woman likes and wants kids, she’s going to care about yours. Which means if the relationship doesn’t work out, you may or may give a crap about her, but she might have cared about your kid(s) and she loses all of those relationships – and the kids lose a relationship with her if they were close at all. That’s a lot of tearing apart. There are types of women who can handle caring for kids and then being torn apart from them. They are called foster mothers – and not every woman is cut out to be one. I’m not sure what you or any other man with kids has to offer that would make a woman want to go through that.

    • Jane

      Right on!! Like i said before, in any relationship it isall about TRUST! How can i know if this single dad is telling me the truth about his childs mother?How can i be sure that this single dad loves me for who i am and not as a target for a nanny to take care of his kids? Simple.

      I’ve been in a relationship with a single dad before. At first i truly loved him and belive everything he had told me. I loved his kids as well. I used to tutor them when they were in thigh school. I loved his kids. Indeed i love whim with all my heart but after i found out that he was divorced due to infedelity on his wife (phone cal from his wife) it really took a toll on me.

      I have trust issues with single dads. That has been the nly problem i face in my past experience.

      • Orlando Bones

        Chick how can you use your one lame experience with a dude whose wife called you and you were ready to believe as some sort of example for every man with kids? GTFOHWTBS we don’t believe you you need more people. You sound like an insecure nightmare for ANY man kids or no kids. Get some help before giving out advice please!

      • notasingledad

        Um how can you find out?

        Easy. You can have a phone conversation with the ex-wife to find out. Simple. Done.
        Stop rationalizing, it makes you a terrible person.

      • Eric

        Trust can be gauged by morality. A father who has full custody of his kids is doing the right thing & thinking about the well being of his kids. This trait of thinking of others prevents you from using & manipulating others (its called a conscience). Untrustworthy people don’t think of others, they don’t care what anyone but themselves feel. You trust a woman who doesn’t have her kids over someone you “i love whim with all my heart” because of one phone call? A woman who doesn’t even think of her own kids needing her is in all probability totally self centered. You leaving might be painful but you did him big favor.

      • yessah3

        And you immediately believed the ex? Did you talk to him about it? Did you get his side? Why would you take her side over his? Sounds like you never trusted him.

    • Funny, you don’t even seem to accept the possibility that there is the example of the single full-time dad, who is so because the mother left the kid(s). As is my case. That happens too you know.

      • theguy12

        Exactly!! Some women are cheating wh*res who leave a man for someone else, or are complete psycho’s.
        But to rationalizing, justifying b*tches like Katja, they will pretend that every single father is a terrible person, because that makes her feel less guilty for ignoring men simply bcuz they can provide her less money.

    • SingleFatherSupporter

      I saw this comment and it stopped me in my tracks…”It pains me when supposed adults (men and women) create innocent
      people and then wreck their little lives through their own selfishness.” WOW!!!!

      I understand your pain but you cannot judge one person’s experience based on another. reading your comments in its entirety, you seem to be putting all men who are not with their baby mama’s (bm) in the same category. I’m also come from a divorced family and shit happens… because a father is not with the mother of his children, does not automatically make him a bad guy. Do you know the circumstances of every such relationship?

      There are so many men who are given the shitty end of the stick because some entitled baby mama (bm) wants to use their child to control. It’s sad for the child and its sad for the father. Not all single mothers are victims as you seem to claim they are…there are always two sides to the story and a point.

      My husband was a single dad who fought hard and is still fighting to get equal rights. He has two kids and never got married (even though he tried numerous times), so Florida law favors the mother in such a case. My husband is there for the kids and I love the kids as though they came from me and they know how I feel so much that they call me mommy (bm hates this by the way…but that’s an entire new article).

      He’s taken responsibility for the poor choice he made in having children with bm…but he lives up to his role as a father and a parent and wants more. But bm doesn’t want him to have more because it will reduce child support…
      See, each situation is different and I feel for those dads that are trying to do right by their kids as well as move on from the hurt, bitterness and negativity they may have initially ran from…

      Don’t judge a book by its cover…

      • Thank you for adding this much needed comment to the dialogue. I will be making this comment a part of a new article about single fathers being mocked and laughed at by the toxic corner of society.

      • pleasewakeupgrl

        SO glad I happened upon this article. Great topic of discussion. I have a friend who is going thru this right now. She’s been seeing a guy for 2 yrs. & frankly I don’t know why. I say that bc although she likes him, she CLEARLY has no desire to ever have any type of relationship w/his kids. He has 2 from a previous marriage & has sole custody of them. The kids don’t have a good relationship w/their mom at all. I told her that I understand that she really likes him, but honestly, how in the world does she ever think she’ll be able to have a permanent relationship w/him if she’s not willing to take on his children as well? You can’t act like they just don’t exist! She’s just fooling herself and I fear she’ll just end up “going through the motions” just for the sake of saying she’s “got someone.” That’s not fair to him, his kids or herself.

      • I wonder what HE is thinking. How do you not notice that your partner isn’t really into your kids. This has got to be the biggest red flag for a parent and I don’t care how much people “want” it to be about them and not their kids, its about you and your kids. It sounds like if your friend caves and they become a mock family of sorts it’s just more hurt and drama for his children – not fair to them at all. If what you say is true then maybe the two of them should be playmates and nothing more – leave the children out of it and keep her away from them. I’ve been through the ringer myself with step-parents who didn’t want us and we knew the entire time and hated them for it. WAKE UP DAD!

      • pleasewakeupgrl

        Before meeting my friend, he only dated women who also had kids. Well, he let his kids dictate whether or not the dating countined. If his kids didn’t like HER kids, it was a wrap. WTH?!? His kids like my friend and she actually likes them. She just doesn’t want to be around them daily as a stepmom or a serious gf. She has nothing against them. She just doesn’t want the responsibility bc they’re not her’s. That’s why I told her she just needs to either move on or just conclude that he’s gonna be a casual bf and leave it at that. Now, as far as he goes…I just don’t know what his deal is. Part of me thinks he’s still shell shocked from the bitter divorce but ended up finding her and he’s content.

        You mentioned being able to tell when the other person doesn’t want to be bothered w/the kids. Well, that may be the answer as well. They don’t live in the same area and only get to see eachother 2-3 x’s a month. Sometimes when they get together, the kids are w/family members or other babysitters. I think maybe he WOULD pick up on it if they were able to c eachother on a more regular basis. I just don’t want it to come to that though. I feel like my gf is just wasting her time bc she can’t find anyone else. Just kind of sad all the way around.

    • yessah3

      Wow, talk about double standard. I guess all divorced fathers everywhere are 100% responsible for broken marriages. I wonder how many people actually think like you do. Personally my parents were divorced, my father was a selfish prick who wanted nothing to do with me or my brother. I never wanted to be divorced for this very reason. I tried just about everything to keep my marriage alive. When you are with a controlling abusive person, eventually you realize you can only change your self and hope for them to change. Eventually you realize they won’t change. Now some figure this out quicker than others. For me, it took 16 years together which got progressively worse. Especially after we had kids. Abusive folks tend to get more abusive after kids because they know they have you locked up with them. They use the kids for manipulative purposes. During the divorce it becomes even more apparent the kids really mean nothing to them only so much in how much they can use them to inflict pain and hurt on you. I hope you don’t have kids, and I hope you don’t ruin some poor guys life. You sound broken.

  • Lilin

    Oh, please. Do some Google-fu. A lot of unchilded guys don’t want to date single moms either. There is no double standard.

    There is nothing “selfish” about an unchilded woman wanting her partner to give her as much as she’s capable of putting in herself. For an unchilded woman, her partner comes first. So why should she be with a single dad, knowing that she’s always going to be in the back seat? That’s not a fair relationship, and yes, no self-respecting person would settle for that. Why should she get back less than she puts in?

    And why are you entitled to be with an unchilded woman anyway? Women aren’t obligated to be with you just because you want them. You bring all this baggage and extra work into a relationship, and you can never give her as much as she gives you. I think you have a lot of gall believing you’re entitled to that.

    This selfish, entitled, sexist behavior is exactly why unchilded people tend to avoid single parents.

    • notasingledadbutjustsaying

      Stop rationalizing. Stop pretending that single dads are worse people than those who don’t.

      Your quote:

      This selfish, entitled, sexist behavior is exactly why unchilded people tend to avoid single parents.

      Uhm, no. Many girls (you included) want the man to pay for everything and want to secure ALL of his money and resources. It’s about MONEY!!! That’s it!!!! You probably cheat on men too with hotter guys, to get better genetics, you sloot.

      • evagreen26

        Same troll under a different username. Get a life. No single, beautiful, young and childless woman is ever gonna want to be with you. It doesn’t matter what their reasons are, it’s their prerogative to choose the type of partner they want to be with. And guess what? It’s never going to be some bitter, jaded dude like you with more baggage than a drag queen on a road trip.

      • yessah3

        If you think a single dude without kids doesn’t have baggage you are fooling yourself. Everyone has baggage. It is how that person deals with the baggage that is important. At least a single father is not shirking responsibilities and facing challenges head on. Who knows if that dude without kids would do the same in a similar situation. Seems crazy to me, but personal choice is the name of the game.

      • Larissa

        The problem is most single dads aren’t dealing with their baggage well. Many introduce their kids right away before dating a woman long enough, many feel guilty for divorcing and spoil their children, many have drama with the ex.

      • cheeze.wiz

        I married a single dad… Who i thought was amazing… But ended up draining my bank accounts… Opening pay day loans in my name and feel phones for his kids… Took out credit cards in my name to buy him and jhis kids shit… Fuck off

    • jab

      Then there dudes with children who expect u to slave for them at the home and put in more effort than they do with their own kids and then we hear that it not fair about finances we should pay half when single dads you brought your child into this world so us non children people shouldn’t have to pay half. It should be less than half. As when asked if u were in our shoes with no kid would u think it fair paying half if you cant all because my child from past is with me.? Ive had guys tell me no they wouldnt. There you go. Then pay for your own kids single dads!

  • CarlaKah

    I do not agree with this piece. I am 27, childfree, have always
    wanted a nuclear family (kids after marriage and the like). So dating a
    man with kids with keep me from getting what I want. Those “dum
    comments” are actually true statements. My husband will come first, only
    our kids together can come before him. That is what I can offer. That
    and my love, affection, hard work and middle-class income. If he is a
    single dad, he can offer me as much as his situation as a parent (paying
    child support, possible alimony, being on his kid’s schedule before
    being on our adult schedule etc) allows. I will always be giving a whole
    lot more. That is not fair. So I choose to go for the pretty picture
    with no outside kids. Sorry, but that is not selfish just realistic. I
    speak from experience. Dealing with single dads whether well employed an
    reliable or not is a whole other dimension of dating.

    • singledadyup

      Uhm logic fail.
      Just because he already has one or more kids, doesn’t mean that he can’t have more with you, ya stupid sl*t.
      What you really mean to say is “I want the man to pay for everything and I want to secure ALL of his money and resources. I am a little spoiled brat and I refuse to share money. Even tho I pretend love isn’t about money, to me, that’s all it is. Mah.”

      how aboutttt you go jump in a fire, k thanks

      • evagreen26

        Jeez man you need to get your head checked.

        Let’s face it, you just can’t accept the fact that given a choice no single, smart, beautiful and successful young woman with no kids would, in their right mind, accept the baggage and drama that comes with a single dad. Relationships are hard enough on their own, why would any young woman in their 20s or even early 30s get involved with a bitter, broke guy with tons of baggage when they have so many other options. Like finding someone like-minded to go on that journey with together, hand in hand, with someonewho will also be experiencing it all for the first time (marriage, children and family life).

      • yessah3

        It makes complete sense, but with age comes wisdom. I see now that a single parent willing to take on the responsibility of loving and caring for a child….and doing it well, is a huge precursor for someone willing to do the same for you. A person without kids is a shell game. You don’t know what you are getting. Kids change marriages. How many marriages fail after kids? Like clockwork. I wish I had kids with my girlfriend. We both had kids from previous marriages and are both good parents and are both sane. Unfortunately we met crazy partners who were both controlling and had us fooled. Have kids with them and you are more trapped than ever. For those looking to start that path walking hand in hand, realize it is russian roulette. Find a good single parent male or female gives you insight that a single person without kids will never give you.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Age doesn’t mean wisdom.. There are plenty of stupid old people

      • Alice

        And yet, divorce rates of first marriages are 30% while those for second marriages including kinds are more than twice that number. Saying you get insight is all well and good but someone being a good parent doen not neccesarily mean being a good partner. You want the best odds of staying together, you date someone without kids and that’s a fact.

      • Lylah

        I really didn’t think she meant she wants a man to pay for everything – it’s more about quality time and focus. It IS a big deal to take on a partner with a ready made family when you don’t have children yourself. There’s alot to think about as step-parenting (which may eventually happen) is a HUGE responsibility and not to be enetred into lightly. It is better to know from the outset whether you want this before feelings get too deep and people get hurt.

        As a single woman with no children I relish
        meeting someone, spending alot of quality time and really bonding with
        someone. I recently met a wonderful single dad (first time for me) who
        was very into me but we just couldn’t get that time together that we
        both wanted due to him having is daughter every weekend and working hard all
        week to make ends meet. I had more freedom naturally and missed him too much – plus too early for me to get to know the child. I think for now that’s where his focus should be until she is a teen and starts her own life.

        He certainly wasn’t a broken man and I
        didn’t see his child/ex as baggage – he was a really great person
        handling things well. I detest single parents being viewed as broken and kids as “baggage”. I have huge respect for him and love the fact he is a good father and gives her alot of quality time. I personally though want a man who is free on weekends to really explore fun things and I didn’t want to make him feel torn. I hope he meets someone who maybe has children themselves whose life fits more easily into his and who is used to children or waits until his time is freed up a bit.

      • jab

        No a fence but obviously he wasnt to interested or concerned about you to priortize time for bonding with you. That’s HIS bad and he shouldn’t have lead you on that he ready to have a relationship when he cant change stuff around to fit you in. Coming from experience dating a single dad. Mine has when he works 50 hrs a week has his child full time& keeps a work out schedule too not just time for me.

      • jab

        And bs kids are viewed as baggage. If they werent then why is there so much dramas not enough time complications and people who expect first treatment. Sad truth too bad those kids ARE baggage. They are with your guy and it is baggage. Anyone dating or married to a man wit kids from his pervious relationship knows from daily weekly hourly chatioc shit constant changes of scheduling learnin to be last alot and being flexible.

      • Michelle Kirkwood

        That’s not even what she was trying to say. Read the post again before jumping all over her and projecting your issues and calling names like a little spoiled brat yourself.

      • Nulligravida

        “logic fail” from someone who invokes a strawman fallacy. LOL!

    • JewelEyed

      You’re not childfree. You’re childless. Childfree means you don’t have and don’t want.

      • CayaK

        At the time I didn’t want any. So…

      • JewelEyed

        Oh really? “…have always wanted a nuclear family (kids after marriage and the like)…”

      • CayaK

        At that time (aged 26-27) I considered myself child-free because at that time I did not want to be a mom yet. Once you want kids (because you feel the time is right or you changed your mind about having kids) you become “childless”. This is how I define it, you may not agree which is totally find.

      • JewelEyed

        I’m sorry, but you don’t get to make up what words mean. And that’s not what it means.

      • CayaK

        Childfree means choosing to not have kids. There is no mention of not being allowed to change ones mind or a time frame. So you are the one who doesn’t get to choose the definition of words. And if your definition entails “never ever wanting kids” that is your choice not the actual meaning of the word.

  • singledad

    I have been dating a girl for about a month now and she is great. She plays catch with my 13 year old son. We go out to dinner, she tries to do little things around my house for me, like the dishes, my laundry. She has a daughter that I just adore. Well out of no where when I told my son her and her daughter were going to stay the night he started bawling his eyes out throwing a fit. He told me he isn’t ready for me to be with anyone. What should I do? I have full custody of my son.

    • Hey singledad, that’s a tough break and it sounds like you need to have a long one and one with your son about his feelings and your feelings. It is important to explain to him fully the situation and respect his opinion when he gives it to you. It is very tough on children and for many of us it never goes away. The good thing is that he is able to tell you how he feels rather than bottling it up and acting out in a negative way. Talk to him to let him see your side of the story and your desire for family, let him see the positives but hear him out on the feelings.

      One of the biggest mistakes you have made is to let your girl into his life so fast, kids need to be eased into our adult relationships and you also have to be 100% sure that your date understands your situation, is willing to form a relationship with your son, and most of all is willing to stick it out. Your son may not do well with people coming in an out of his life and you have to be cognizant of that. Date on your own time but only bring him into it when you are ready to start the courtship towards a possible permanent future.

      Talk to your son and if he says it’s a no-go then it’s a no-go. I hope things work out but if they don’t just remember that the introduction to the kid needs to be deep in the game when he is wanting you to be happy (even if it’s not with his mom) and the woman that you are with is willing to put in the time to befriend him. Talk it out, and good luck.

      • singledad

        Well I have known the woman since we were in high school and we kind of just rekindled things after 15 years. He has been great with her since he has met her and has been around her. Even when I’m on the phone with her he will be yelling at her telling her she needs to come over. So I thought all has been going well. Then just out of no where he starts crying Saturday night saying he isn’t ready when I mention her staying the night… I love my son, but I cant help but wonder if it is an act of jealousy? Maybe wanting all of my attention to be on him – is that a fair reason to end things with her? He also started saying he missed his stepmom, which I find hard to believe, because she was never involved in any of his activities, never showed interest in him.. all around it was a bad marriage, she was with me for my money and left me twice for different men.

      • Well you know your son, so talk to him about it. Boys typically don’t do the attention thing unless you have been absent from his life – I don’t think that would be the issue. At 13 he is allowed to miss his mom, even if she’s Joan Crawford but you need to hear it from him. Take him somewhere, talk to him, and see if he will see your side on things.

      • Dr. Carly

        Hi Single dad, My heart goes out to you, because this is a tricky one. Let me preface my response by saying this is just my opinion and not meant to be any type of professional advise. I realize everyone operates from a different value system and have varied philosophy about child-rearing, so I don’t expect, neither am I looking for agreement. This is how I actually raised two young men successfully, as a single mom.

        First and foremost – you are the parent – always! There is never any role reversal, especially with a 13-year old. That is a great age for reasoning, but NOT for decision making. Keep in mind that by the time he is 18 to 21 years old, he will be chasing his own loves, and you will be left alone at home, on the couch. My younger son is 33 and I couldn’t get him to hang with me right now if I paid him.

        On the other hand, it sounds like two women (his biological mom and his step mom) “left” him behind (in his mind). His behavior might be from fear and not necessarily jealousy. Both are negative emotions and how they “show up” is never pretty. I am not sure if he has any active contact and continued relationship with these women, which would have shown him that they did not divorce him – just you.

        He definitely is open and accepting, as he has demonstrated in different ways to your current love. Yet, he is somehow misconstruing the idea of a sleep over as another possible set up for abandonment. If you are truly serious about taking this relationship to another level, I suggest that you give it more time before you and your girl “disappear” behind closed doors, in the presence or knowledge of these two teenagers. Do more as a “family-unit”, and also allow your son to invest some alone time with your girl to get to know her without you around. In this way, he can create his own positive experiences that might allay his fears. You could probably do the same with her daughter. These are the things successful blended families are made of.

        Relationship dynamics are never circular, but more triangular or linear. You and your son, your son and your girl, and you and your girl. Adding the daughter, you can map a similar matrix, including your son and his new sibling to be, and the daughter and you, as well as daughter and mom. The fact that you have a great relationship with the daughter might not make this easier for your son either; probably creating more angst as he struggles with his own fear of losing another parent.

        Model for him strong, loving, lasting relationships. Divorce does not have to mean the end of friendship, contact, or some form of a relationship. Continue to give the assurance that you will always be there in more concrete ways than just saying it. Have those “man-to-man” talks about life, love and loss, and what it will be like when he gets his heart broken (because it will), and what it means to lose love, love again and move on. Let him know that is what you are experience at this time. Just be sure he is ready for this type of conversation, and perhaps wait to be “invited” in to talk about this. You do this by having continued open dialogue (not one-sided lectures full of judgement) about all topics. This will make it more likely to happen with you than with his mis-informed peers.

        What you should not do is abscond your position as the adult and try to be your son’s “friend”. You should continue to make your own life’s decisions without your son participating in the decision making, especially about your love life. What would be the basis of his opinion? His 13 years of living? This is not his place, and psychologically, this is a huge burden for him to bear. Good wishes to all four of you, and here’s to love!

  • Eric

    I am a single dad & I can tell you that no woman wants anything to do with me now. Before the mom decided drugs were just the stuff to build her life on & we shared custody I had no problem meeting women, even as a introvert.

    I see it over & over, when a woman finds out I am a single dad her interest just melts away like when the sun melts snow in the spring. At the same time I get told they see the content of my character or something like that & I’m obviously a good man.

    Single moms I know have no trouble getting dates.

    I am good looking, well groomed, own my own business, have 4 college degrees, am talented (sold my first piece of art at 12 years old), & can be counted on to do the right thing.

    However there seems to be this weird trend that underlies it all.

    women I meet seem to live in a land of make believe where they wait to be swept off their feet by prince charming, & I think it’s getting worse. There is a total denial of the financial reality 99% of people are in so
    it’s obvious they don’t have the ability to do simple math. They often make contradictory statements. Believe themselves to be without fault or short coming, & are looking for a reason to reject anyone. I also see how they think instant chemistry is love, which is often just infatuation & don’t realize that love grows over time & have no idea what the difference is. They believe everything they think, & use indirect communication as a tool to alleviate accountability.

    What they don’t realize is they’re revealing their true character, & not the kind a man wants to marry, so when they suddenly see fantasy isn’t real professing; “I’m ready to get married to a regular guy” there wont be any takers.

    • Yossarian

      Eric – I’m about to become a single dad (divorcing the mother of my daughters). Hopefully I’ll get >%50 custody of each, as – well – there are reasons I’m divorcing her. Anyways, I wanted to ask you: Have you had any luck finding women who do not meet your description above? I’m planning, once things are settled down, to cast a very wide net in hopes of catching the prized “rational woman”. I know they exist, because I’ve encountered a handful over the past 5 years (and kicked myself for marrying a psycho). Of course, they were 99% happily married (good on them!) and typically older than I (now 33). My hopes are that by registering on one or more dating websites, sending “my own truest and best self vibes” in all directions and taking things slowly (online chat -> phone -> coffee or lunch date(s) -> evening date(s) -> entire day(s)) with multiple women I might eventually find one to focus on and invest in. Have you tried anything like that? – Yossarian

      • kb

        you are an a***hole. Your woman is not a “psycho”. You are. Why didnt you employ this strategy before you got married and then f***ed up and now have an ex “psycho” wife who you never really loved, and kids that you have ruined their lives. Women are not psychos, they become like that because their man is not showing them enough LOVE. Think of your children first. And then think about why you couldnt love your wife enough.

      • yessah3

        Although I agree this guy is a douche, there are psycho women, believe me. LOL!

      • yessah3

        Jesus, don’t get divorced on hopes of meeting the perfect woman. Get divorced because you will be happier ALONE. I say that with all honesty. You will never be happy with someone else unless you can be happy alone. You will only end up making them miserable. You are getting divorced from someone you had kids with. Work on yourself for a while before you start dating.

      • cheeze.wiz

        I think most of what you say is pretty stupid. But this is actually sound advice. Good for you

    • Coracreates

      Hi Eric. I think you might be making assumptions that you – as a single dad – are having no luck with dating but single women have no issues. As a single mom, I can get dates if I am the one to pursue the man or if I say yes to any guy who whistles at me in the supermarket – but those aren’t the men I want to date. I take good care of myself and my son – I am stable in my life – a strong woman. I don’t like commenting on looks of myself or others – but I have been told I am very attractive. Dates – they are pretty non-existent though but I don’t think it’s always because I am a single mom. I’m attracted to the wrong people and I am also not exposed to a lot of people where I live…not living int he best place right now. I don’t know what my point was..but…based on your comment – I think it might be something else turning the women off. I really deeply cared for a man years ago and we dated. He was Mr. Everything – a teacher, a major in the Army, a self-proclaimed amazing dancer – just mr. everything you could imagine he has done. He would brag a tiny bit – or a lot about the dancing – and even that alone was intimidating to me. He seemed like he was never good enough (for himself) as he kept striving for bigger and better things. I think that scared me deep down – that I wouldn’t satisfy him longterm because he seemed like he wasn’t content with himself through all his achievements. I don’t mean to assume any of this about you – just some things to think about as you reminded me of him.

      The other thing you mentioned about the fantasy romance stuff…I learned to avoid all that garbage. I prefer not to waste any time with a guy in investing into any type of fantasy type ideas and thoughts – it can happen too naturally. I prefer to be more realistic and met with someone and expect absolutely nothing – hope for a good conversation, friendship and if anything happens further than great. Too many people jump into these crazy fantasies about how the other person might fulfill them – turns into obsessions – and then I say goodbye at that point. 🙂 I hope you find a stable, wonderful woman. 🙂

  • Trudy D May

    I meet my soul mate, Jason over 8 years ago. After a nasty divorce and me with grown children. His children were 13 and 5 at the time and he shared custody with their mother. Long story short..his daughter,now 13 just moved in with us in Aug. because her mom decided to move to the Netherlands with her 7th husband leaving her daughter behind with no contact. Its a strained situation but I love Jason and she’s part of him and we co-parent together. I cant imagine ever living without BOTH of them in my life. When they came into life, in my opinion, it only added interest and a stronger bond between us. I have so called friends that ask me why I would want to help raise another child with having grown kids myself but I dont see it as being a problem. We are very happy , faithful and supportive of each other. When you’re a good woman, a good man will find you.

    • Coracreates

      Finally something I can agree with and relate to. I keep reading all these negative comments – referring to kids as the “seed” of the person. Kids are real people – amazing – honest and blunt – and I see them as a gift and not a curse. If I met a man who had kids already and we loved each other I would love them as my own 100%. I think your situation is a beautiful example Trudy. 🙂

    • Ann Brown

      Your situation is different,you both have children. This topic is about single parents dating child free adults.

      • EntitledToMe

        Narcissist alert.

      • cheeze.wiz

        “narcissist” … I do not think it branded what you think it means

      • T-800 Terminator


      • cheeze.wiz

        Oh you’re so bad

    • yessah3

      Exactly, if more women would view a relationship as having deeper connections. When you are with someone, you accept them and who they are unconditionally. That includes kids if they have them. If you can’t do that, then you don’t love them. For those that rule people out for having kids, its shallow and naive. Those single guys or girls you meet, have probably a greater chance of being selfish than a single parent. I guess that is Karma though.

  • lone parent

    i just wan to say that was a very good read and it has gave me that bit of confidence for future reference thanks .
    lone male parent …

    • yessah3

      You will be fine. Bit of advice, find a single mom with a similar circumstance as you.

  • lone parent

    lone parent …
    the way i see things going in Brittan is that the change is coming , going through the courting system myself and winning my case for my children and being given full custody from the courts , not sure of the American term for this is but it scares woman knowing that you have the capability to challenge and be victorious in the courting system that has been put in front of you .
    my past experiences have been mixed were people would congratulate u for your effort or speak highly of you being a father to burden himself with his children . As you see for what i am trying to get at the miss understanding for a father to take on his children as a loving parent It is a world wide problem from country to country and it continues to this day .
    i have seen some sad site around the British isles from the hard deprived areas to the well lets say the better off , fathers being jaunted to the side because of who they are or what they are worth to society then you get the differences i could go on but it is happening now , i’m one of the lucky ones put it like that and finding woman if it happens its ment to happen if they care then make it happen your choice your life don’t forget when making your children happy you need to be happy so stop hiding when knocked down get back up and try again you did it once before so whats stopping you again .

    • trinimom

      I wish america would come around… but its a long long road ahead. Too many ole school judges who think that only a mother can provide the right care for a child.

      • yessah3

        Exactly. By the mere fact they have a vagina, they somehow make a better parent. Tell that to my oldest son who was regularly abused by my ex. I had to fight like hell to get custody. My ex wouldn’t have had to fight nearly as hard if roles were reversed. Talk about double standards. Todays’ family court system in the US is so totally screwed up.

  • angie

    i read most of the comments from parents talking about small kids. But what if you’re an ADULT who doesn’t care for the idea of your dad talking to all these different women? And bringing them over to the house which me and my dad currently share! Does anybody find that inappropriate?
    I’m 35 years old. My mom died back in 2010. I have been living with my dad for quite some time. I know he gets a little lonely. But come on! Some of the women I’ve met that he have brought to the house are no older than me. And he does bring a lady friend by from time to time, an older woman. This one bosses me around as if she’s my mom and been with us my whole life. I wish he would respect the fact that I also live under the same roof. I’m referring to my dad. I live there because I know the house is paid for, and I’m not ready for my own place yet because I’m not ready for the extra responsibilities and the fear of being alone especially at night. If someone might have some suggestions without criticizing that would be great. And my dad, by the way, is in his 60s. Hes at that age where he should just be a one-woman guy. In my opinion, anyway.

    • dogbone

      Bitch you’re 35 move out and get your own life. Let your dad get any action he wants. He’s 60 for fucks sake. 35 and still living at home SMH.

    • ktmckinsey

      That’s completely none of your business. You’re a grown adult (older than me, actually). You’re lucky he lets you live in his house. Stop complaining about how he runs his life. I’m saying this as a 29 year old woman with two daughters. If I died and my children were adults, I would hope my husband would be able to find other partners to fill his time.

    • cheeze.wiz

      You’re dad can do what he wants. You’re a 35 year old brat

    • yessah3

      You are an adult, grow up and move out if you don’t like it. If you truly love your dad, you want for him what makes him happy. Age where he should just be a one woman guy???? LOL! OMG, that is hilarious. OK, so where is this list of ages and amounts of partners one can have? I have never seen it but would love to, for laughs.

  • Natasha

    Hi all I will like some advice please. I have been seeing this guy for 19months and when we met all was great he asked if I liked kids and would date anyone with kids I said I have no problem with it so 3months into the relationship he told me he had 2 gals one is 13 in july and the other will turn 11 in december by the same woman and they broke up 6years ago however he is still involved in the gals lives. 7months into the relationship he said we are official he will like to introduce me to the baby mama and the kids but something happened we ended up not going through with it. He had the gals around he invited me to come meet them couldn’t make it as had an emergency to take care of which he understood and agreed we do it again soon. The baby mama is drama the break up wasn’t pretty and most of the times I’m with him she will call shouting about this and that and she won’t get the kids to school on time as my boyfriend works 240 miles away from where they live he can’t take the kids to school unless he is on holiday. So weekends and half term he makes time to be with the gals. The baby mama just is drama but that’s just her character. He has introduced me to his parents, sister and brothers and his friends if there are functions we go together. The this bank holiday Monday he went down as he has a house 20minutes to where they live to see them as its also half term. I called on a Sunday the Lil one picked the phone and I asked to speak to the dad she went and gave him the phone we spoke all was ok. Then on the Monday called but no answer so tried his other line and a woman answered. She asked who was calling I said why who am I speaking to she mentioned her name and I said from where she said I’m his gal friend I said what I’m his gal Frend too and she asked for how long for told her almost 2years she said she has known him for almost 16years I then said oh so you the baby mama she said yes. She started screaming down calling him there is a gal here saying she is your galfrend who is she. He answered her and said yes she is right, she is my galfrend he said it 3 times and the baby mama said why you lying to her what about me and he said but she is my galfrend. He took the phone from her and spoke to me a bit and said will call back. He called 10minutes later the kids where crying saying daddy has a girlfriend and all that they been together for almost 2years. They say they wanna go with their mummy because their dad has a girl friend. That now has caused a problem between me and him because he said that is not how he wanted the kids to find out. He wanted to introduce me the right way now I have given the woman more to shout about using him having a galfrend against the kids. He said I should have told her my name not ask her who she was too and I could have said I’m his friend as I have witnessed it when with him how she is not ok in the head and he talks to me about it yet I have encouraged her cause I got defensive cause a woman pick the phone what if it was his sister. After our long chat on Monday he said I did it on purpose to bring division  between him and the kids. He said I had an agenda cause now the older one of the gals asked if he will come down this weekend and he said he has a lot to do and the mum said tell your dad he is Lying he will be with his galfrend. He is angry at me and didn’t call for 4days and called today saying the same how I did wrong he thought i was mature about it and now the woman is chatting more crap. He said now he will focus on his kids and anything he promised he would do for me he will settle it and focus on his kids. I asked what about our relationship he said he hasn’t gone that far thinking of it now his focus are the kids. So now my question why did the woman say his galfrend, if nothing happened recently between them. He said it was not my place to tell her I’m his galfrend he would have done it properly as we have spoken about it many times and how to do it smoothly but I reacted should she have said its his baby mama or ex galfrend.  Was I wrong with saying this and asking her who she was. Should I have just said my name when she asked who was calling and said will call later. He is now and still angry with me and it seems the relationship between us is gone and I don’t know how to go about it. I will not make any attempt to call or text that I will not do but he is acting like I have come to break him and the kids apart cause they heard their mum saying he has a galfrend. I just need advice. Thank you. 

    • Sounds to me like he has decided to move on Natasha and you should do the same. When I wrote this article I was referring to men who know how to balance a relationship with their children and your guy sounds like he is not able to. It sounds chaotic and nightmarish and you don’t deserve to be involved in any of that.

      • Kat Bircher

        And that’s why we women don’t want single dads…they are unable to compartmentalise things, set boundaries, prioritise and consider everyone’s feelings or multi-task. Men can only think of their needs and their needs include looking to the world to be doing the right thing. Sadly this means they over focus on the child, the ex and telling the world their child is ‘their world’. As a single parent of 20 years I’ve never felt the need to say that! Single dads need to get their heads out of their arses lol

      • John

        And you Kat demonstrate why single dads need to be so vigilant with their kids: to protect them from people like you.

      • Kat

        You disagree with blatant truths.. That’s fine .. Not my problem.. My opinion. You carry on pussy footing around ‘single dads’..John.
        It’s the negative effect all that facade and guilt has on the kids! that’s why we should ALL be vigilant around single dads.. For the children.

      • harvey mushman

        “You disagree with blatant truths..”

        “… My opinion.”

        Please explain.

      • trinimom

        stop generalizing.

      • yessah3

        I think the line “Men can only think of their needs” as saying it all. Admit you hate men. Sad. I bet you ex hurt you like mine did to me. But I don’t hate all women. I look at people as people, some are bad and some are good. What you said is not only wrong, but completely sexist.

  • Den Un

    Some women just don’t like or want children. It’s a hard concept for single moms and dads to grasp since they love their children-as they should.

  • John

    Women are extremely insecure, jealous and selfish. They do believe that they’ll never be first, and they’re right. And that is as it should be. Do you ladies mean to tell me that if you had a child, he/she would not always be first with you? Of course not. Then why should a single father be any different? No woman will ever come before my kids. They are my flesh and blood, they were here first, and they’ll be with me forever. This doesn’t mean I couldn’t be a good husband. The woman just needs to realize that the kids come first. If you’re not OK with that, don’t let the door hit you on the way out. We will all be much better off without you.

    • tasha

      Braaaaaap as it should be. But this is part of the reason I choose to just stay single for life

      • cheeze.wiz

        Hell yeah

    • Max

      Men are just as selfish and jealous How many times have men rejected women with children because they want to be first? Or hate the Idea of accepting a woman with a child that’s not his ? Don’t be a sexist dick.

    • Katarina Novak

      No! A relationship where the kid comes first, is doomed to failure.

      • John Q. Public

        Hahahah ITS ALL ME ME ME with you. Disgusting.

      • Katarina Novak

        Look who’s whinging!

      • John Q. Public

        You no nothing about relationships, tw(a)t

      • Katarina Novak

        That’s quite an accusation, from a moron who bred with an unsuitable partner, wasn’t able to sustain even that relationship, and is now stuck with the little mistakes.

    • Ally

      If that’s really your attitude you shouldn’t be dating. Your kids are mistakes that shouldn’t even exist in the first place and now you want a decent woman to play second fiddle to those things. That’s precisely what will make you a bad husband to any woman.

    • Jenn

      You’re right about the part that kids should come first. They really should.

      The big but here is, if you date a woman without kids you’ll be first for her. So what you want is a position in her life that you aren’t able to reciprocate. Where does that leave her? Do you really think that knowing the most important person in her life will never see her in the same light. Will never find her as important as she finds him. That her time and effort also have to go to his child while she has to do with less because of that same child. Thar her first marriage, her first child, her first family vacation and christmas will never be as special to you as they are to her because you had those moments with another women. How can you even for a second delude yourself into believing that those things won’t hurt her? Do you really believe that a woman should just give up on everything she dreamed of ever since she was 3 or 4 years old because of your kids? Do you really truly think that taking away so much of what is important to almost any woman is being a good husband? There is nothing in this world as soul-crushing, hurtfull and humiliating to a woman than knowing you’re not at the same point in life as het and knowing it’s another woman who gave him the greatest joy in life, that first child.

      I don’t go around asking you to chop your man-parts off, put on a pink tuutuu and wear a sign around your neck that says; unable to satisfy a woman. Why do you call doing a similar thing to a woman bein a good husband?

  • Tee

    So a woman is immature if she wants to and knows that she supposed to come first? Ok. I’m going to be the one cooking for you and your seed ( who isn’t mine), cleaning our house, making lunches for you and your seed (who isn’t mine), making dinner for you and your seed (who isn’t mine), taking care of you and your seed (who isn’t mine) if either of you get sick, working to provide for an education, clothing, food and clothing for your seed (who isn’t mine), and fulfilling your needs as my wifely duty and I’m immature for wanting and knowing my rightful place as first? Ok. God laid out a clear path for success when it comes to relationships. Him first, your spouse second (who’s supposed to become 1 flesh with you), kids third and so forth. What you’re telling me is I’m supposed to accept being less than who God intended for me to be because you made a decision to procreate before seeking His guidance. Ok. Preach that to someone who doesn’t understand the critical role that they play in a man’s life! I’m going to be a provider, lover, friend, coach, care-taker, etc. If you think I’m willing to play second fiddle because of a decision you made before me, you’re sadly mistaken. I usually don’t comment on blogs but being a woman who recently left a single Dad because of his situation (i.e. grown daughter, meddling baby-mother, etc.) I HAD to post a comment. Let me be as frank as I can, and I promise you I’m not judging because I understand that we ALL make bad decisions that we wish we could take back!!! I think single parents are the ones who need a reality check as opposed to the people who are dealing with them!! Frankly, I shouldn’t have to suffer because you made a child with someone who it’s not going to work with

    • tasha

      Simple don’t get with a single parent and if there are no other options stay single yourself.

  • Tee

    Sorry my Ipad froze up! But in summation, I shouldnt jhave to suffer (being 2nd, interruptions by the BM, interruptions by the child) because you decided to make a child with someone who it doesn’t work out with?!?! Ok. Look- single parents need to get a grasp on reality, especially when dealing with someone who doesn’t have kids. The reality is (and I pray that I’m never in this situation) you come to the table with way more baggage than the person you are dealing with. You need to find that happy balance of making sure that everyone who matters (I.e, your child AND your potential mate) are happy. You need to be sure that your past doesn’t muddle up your future. And most importantly, you need to make sure that everyone plays their God-intended role in your life. Dude, one day, your child is going to leave to start their own life…you need to make sure that the one who’s going to be by your side when that happens (I.e. Your significant other) is as happy as can possibly be. Happy wife=happy life. Again, I didn’t post to judge but there are some deep-seeded feelings with me when it comes to single Dads and their expectations. All in all, I wish you the best- I just hope that when/if you do meet a good woman, you’ll recognize her and treat her accordingly!

    • trinimom

      you have some good points but how do you know what “is someone’s God-intended role”. I’m married to a man with 2 kids from a previous relationship and the good Lord knows I need the patience and strength of Job and the grace of God to get through some days… But I don’t need my husband to put me first as its not about me… its about the children. Yes even some crazy mb’s child, because the child didn’t ask to be brought into the world or to have to deal with a messed up situation.
      We have our own lil one now, and for me its about her first and the stepkids after. My hubby may not like that but sorry… our child is our full time responsibility while the stepkids are my part time responsibility. If you look at it the step kids got it made…3 parents who love them and two of everything!
      At the end of the day it all boils down to communication and doing whats best for the family, kids and significant other included. NOT doing what significant other wants because he’s supposed to put her first… that’s some real crybaby ish as far as I’m concerned… and that’s my 2 cents.

      • Tee

        If you’re a Christian woman, I’m sure that you’re aware of the order that God intended families to operate in. If something’s out-of-order, it doesn’t work. Your husband came to the table with four people (assuming the kids have the same Mom) and you decided to deal with that, and that’s your right, just like it’s my right to decide that I’d prefer to build a family with my man, versus trying to fit into one that’s ready-made. If you’ve decided that it’s okay for you to be last on your husbands list of priorities and you’re fine with that, cool. That’s just not for me- I’m too aware of the value that I bring to the table. I’m not going to resort to name-calling (as you did) but I will say this – you can’t tell me that there haven’t been times that you thought of how much healthier and easier your relationship would be IF all the extra people weren’t involved. My whole point in responding was that it’s a bit selfish to think that the child-free person who comes to the table is just supposed to deal with and embrace all the extra drama without taking into consideration the strain that the kids who aren’t theirs puts on the relationship. You should Google “selfish single parents” and see the number of people who wrote warnings to people who were in my situation. They knew EXACTLY what I was going through and that’s not selfish, immature, or in your words “cry-babyish”…it’s called being a realistic human being.

      • Tee

        Sorry my Ipad froze again! But may I add the fact that you mentioned yourself that your husband “May not like” the fact that you’re more focused on the little one you guys had together than HIS kids. That alone indicates that there may be some level of friction between you and your husband because you’re doing what’s instinctively right- looking out for your seed! You’ve proven my point with that statement….it’s in all of us to protect & look out for our progeny but because he decided to procreate before you met him is potentially having a negative impact on the bond that you all have now!?!?! That’s it right there! I want all of our “firsts” to be mutual…first time they sit up, first words, first time that they walk!! The excitement isn’t mutual if he’s “been there, done that” (times 2 in your situation)!! And not to mention the fact that I may have to deal with a child who wasn’t raised to my standards! All I’m saying is, be mindful of what (and who) you bring tot the table and be realistic about your expectations. That was the whole point In commenting on the main post because I think a lot of single parents are trying to justify (while having unrealistic expectations for their mates) why someone who’s just dealing with it should just stick around and “deal”. With billions of people on the planet, I think I’ll take my chances versus just dealing with nonsense.

  • l

    I don’t have an issue with single fathers. I have an issue with single fathers who don’t have their crap together, or who are into weird eff’d up stuff that caused the dissolution of their first marriage and then drag that garbage into their new relationship or who aren’t taking care of their children.

    And no, I want a man who knows how to prioritize. I don’t need to be first all the time, but my needs should absolutely come first in certain circumstances, like when I’m ill for instance.

    And I’m sick of single fathers who think their children are so damn special that I’ll be so distracted I won’t notice what a ***t partner they are to me.

    • Zip it

      I am very amazed you are not yet married! With your me first attitude and hatred for men, I figured you would be in a very successful relationship.

      With another woman.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Id call you a pussy but mine just got offended

  • Kevin

    In my experience the most common thing I noticed being a single father, dating women is that some really love the idea of a single father. Once they realize that I am a single father for real, not just a fly by father, the nostalgia of being a single father runs out quickly and it usually is the end of our relationship. Since I had my son (who is nine years old, almost ten) I have only been in two real relationships, one lasted for almost 2 years, but it ended because of the relationship of my son and my ex, and another when my son went to visit his grandmother for summer break. Once he returned home, my gf at the time, grew distant very fast and eventually pulled out and cut all ties.

    After reading some of these articles about how women really feel about dating single fathers, it became quite a reality check and put my life in perspective. I came to the conclusion that I might not ever find that other person and actually began to learn to love the person who I became and appreciate everything that I do have in my life. Most of all my son. I learned to keep busy with exercise and other activities, especially physical outdoor activities I could do with my son.

    Being a single parent is something that I would never change for anything or anyone. Sure I miss out on the odd party or group event with friends, but the moments I gained since becoming a single parent is something that is priceless to me and I couldn’t be happier.

    I have nothing against women who want to come first. We all want to come first and not being a parent themselves how could they truly understand what it’s like to be a parent, let alone a single parent at that. I was resentful for a long time towards women, but you can’t expect everyone to drop their beliefs and understand what you are going through and if they do not understand, call them selfish, ungrateful, etc….Only another parent could understand what the situation is and what the weight of having a child is really like. So I cannot hold this against women who do not have kids and want the freedom of not having a kid.

    I usually have more input, but this is kind of on the fly at the moment, but I hope it puts what I am going through in perspective and maybe there’s other single parents feeling the same way.

    • Kevin

      Oh ya being both the mother and father, I learned how to be house broken. I also cooked throughout high school and college as a part time job (which thank god really helped in the future). I noticed when I did actually allow a women over to my place, this was usually a turn on, that I keep a clean home and know how to cook healthy and delicious meals, and at the same time it brought out some of their insecurities as well. Usually I hear about how they cannot cook, or their place is a mess.

      When dating another single mother they are usually blown away by this, especially if they were trying to clean up their dishes after a meal and instinctively I played with the children, or helped her out. As a single father I feel that I was able to appreciate all of the little things and not take them for granted.

      • Coracreates

        Sounds wonderful. 🙂 I would love to date a single dad who can cook and take care of things himself. 🙂 very attractive!

    • Coracreates

      Hi Kevin. I understand how you feel. I have 100% been the sole provider for my son who is almost 10. I have had one serious relationship with another single parent. He wasn’t too involved with his kids though. I rarely date. I also focus on exercise, learning and really living and loving life with my son. If I am meant to be with someone I suppose it will happen but my experiences with dating haven’t gone too well. And you are right that only other single parents know what it is like. Some single dads are just there on the weekends with the kids. For you to be the sole provider – you really would understand. 🙂 It is tough. But, I am happy to have such a sweet, bright kid who appreciates life. 🙂

    • EmilyNZ

      I think you have a great attitude Kevin – it’s refreshing to hear a dad who as you say has had a “reality check” about his situation. Just as nothing can really prepare you for all the ways your life will change when you become a parent (so I’m told anyway!), I think nothing can really prepare you for the reality of being in a relationship with a parent – especially of a young child (with or without an ex-spouse involved). You might believe you are ready to take it on – other people can warn you and you can anticipate some of the issues that might arise. But as with most things in life, you really can’t know how a situation is going to make you feel until you are experiencing it. I spent a long time beating myself up, feeling guilty and selfish for eventually walking away… despite my ex even thanking me for being so patient and accommodating of his situation.

      The reality is most people don’t grow up dreaming of becoming a step-parent. For most people it involves a HUGE adjustment of not just their relationship expectations but what they might have imagined for their whole life and having a family in the future. A lot of choices they’ve probably taken for granted in the past get taken away from them – and I don’t mean things like being able to take off on weekends away whenever they feel like it. The single parents who call a childless person selfish if they have a hard time coming to terms with all the compromises and sacrifices they have to make to be with them sound so unbelievably self-entitled to me now. Do they ever stop and consider how they would feel in the reverse position?

      Although single parents might be happier with someone who can relate to their situation, don’t automatically assume that it can never work with someone who’s not a parent too. Just don’t get caught up in an unrealistic fantasy that someone without kids will unhesitatingly mold their whole life to suit your needs and priorities, simply because they may have the flexibility to do so.

    • Larissa

      Maybe if more dads were understanding and treated the women better more would be open. I’m constantly being searched by dads and many have lied and said they would be open to a child with me and they never wanted another they wanted to get me and thought I would change my mind. Many as soon as we’re in a relationship expect me to play a motherly role I’m unfamiliar with. Many try to change me to fit into their and their kids life. I make 95% percent of changes in relationship. I have to change what milk I drink because their kids don’t like skim, I have to trade in a romantic honeymoon for a family vacation, I may not like certain aspects of their parenting but I have to put up with it. I have to deal with an ex. None of my ex’s are in my life. Yeah I would want to date me too! I’m tired of being treated like a commodity. And anytime I mention something I’m not happy about I get ignored. And then after awhile I feel unappreciated and unloved. It’s happened several times and I’m done trying. Single dads need to date single moms. They relate better. Many don’t want to because it’s more work. They have to compromise 50/50. And many. Are too selfish to do so. If you really want to be with a childless woman don’t search for her. If you happen to meet her and fall and in love with her make sure she knows it.

  • Thea

    Im 24 and child free and have met a 30 something single father with three kids (two his, one his ex partners) he sees them every weekend and twice in the week. I have my own goals and aspirations in terms of my future but it has never put me off.
    There was no suggestion of meeting the children for the first six months anyway so that was ‘normal’ dating and past that point we were close enough that it seemed natural to want to know and be involved in more of his life. I am ‘dads friend’ and whilst i enjoy their company (i love kids and have a godchild similar in age that i dote on) I also appreciate that however unconventional, they belong to a unit that i will never be part of and that family unit includes his ex (rightly so).
    Its not about ‘firsts’ but it is -as others have said- a daunting prospect to get involved with and something that requires more effort and a great deal more thought. I am fortunate that his children are young and accepting and i have not yet met their mother but I can imagine that her primary concern will simply be to assert if i am suitable to be around her children. Completely understandable but not going to be the most comfortable moment i imagine, OP, i think you’re being unfair and naive about the reasons some women choose to stay away from single fathers. I see being with my incredible partner as the priority but the next few months will be awkward for us and that is soley because of the added pressures involved in choosing to date someone with children. Things like living arrangements suddenly have to be deliberated much harder etc x

  • Dawn

    I don’t date dads, and I don’t make apologies for it. I don’t want to deal with the drama, or the financial (did you know many stepparents end up supporting the kids or the ex?)or the other issues. Also, as a devout Catholic we do not believe in divorce unless there is an annulment. It’s not my fault the single parent is often a failure, why should I take their poor choices? However, I would consider a single dad who doesn’t have an ex in the picture, like he is widowed or had kids on his own.

    • Coracreates

      “It’s not my fault the single parent is often a failure”….wow!!!!! Let those without sin cast the first stone…

      • Dawn

        Actually I never had kids so not a failure in that. So yes I can cast the first stone. There’s no excuse to be married multiple times or have many kids out of wedlock with different people.

      • Coracreates

        Having kids doesn’t equate to being a failure. Having my son was the best thing that ever happened to me. You said, “So yes I can cast the first stone.” Sure you can – and you have – and you can do as you like. In your life, someday you may be in a situation yourself – where you need the compassion or kindness of others to help you through. God loves everyone – all the sinners – including you. As you judge others – He will judge you. Personally, I have one child from one man. He forced himself on me and pinned me down and I said “No” about three times. It happened and I was pregnant. I am grateful for my child. I have raised him myself and with the grace of God. People can judge me – or make assumptions and that is fine. I’d rather be judged by someone like you than treat people the way you are on here. God bless everybody – single, married, gay, straight, unwed and everyone in between! It is not my job to judge the lifestyles of others – God tells us in the Bible that the most important thing is to LOVE. So you take care, Dawn!

      • Dawn

        Well having one kid out of rape is different than having kids by multiple partners. There’s something wrong with a person like that.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Almost everyone says “my kids are the greatest thing that ever happened to me…” must suck to be such a pos you put the value of your capability on your child… What a burden you’re going to be when you’re old… I bet you’re one of those parents who says “i do so much for you…” to your kid all the time

  • John Q. Public

    Single dad here. 32.

    First off, lots of good points.

    Now, its unfortunate so many eligible single women have this ego-based idea of “ME ME ME #1 !!!”….I would never date anyone like that, with or without kids. I connect with compassionate, wise women that aren’t materialistic and love life. Seems to be a character fault of mannnnny people. And thats cool. I stray from those folks. You can enjoy a life of attachment to money and the endless pursuit of it, but me and mine, we do just fine.

    • JewelEyed

      Not everyone who doesn’t date guys with kids is like that though. I
      happen to not be in the market for a partner, but I was once upon a
      time. I am childfree. That means I do not want to be a parent and I have
      never wanted to. I do not hate kids, but I am not interested in being a
      parent at all. I get a lot of judgment for that, assumptions that I am
      somehow obligated to have kids, but let’s put that one aside for a
      second. Primarily because I think we can all agree that people who don’t
      want kids probably shouldn’t be having them. If that’s how I feel, I am
      not going to date a man with children. Why? Because that’s not fair to

      That’s not fair to the guy because he should really be
      with someone who will get on famously with his kids so he doesn’t have
      to stress out about how he’s gonna make it all work. It’s not fair to
      the kids if he isn’t. I remember what it was like to have a stepmom who
      didn’t care about me unless she felt like yelling at me or using me as
      her au pair and maid so she could sit on her ass all day. And it’s not
      fair to me because that’s not how I want to live my life, unhappy and
      obviously not making the people I’ve chosen to be around happy.

      I chose to date men who felt as I did and were willing to opt out of
      parenthood. I don’t think that’s selfish at all, actually. There have
      been a few men I loved very much, that I couldn’t be with because the
      timing was bad, that went and got in a relationship with someone else
      and had kids, and then were single again because that didn’t work out. I
      found out that they still wanted to be with me. Don’t you think I
      wanted still wanted to be with them?

      But you know what? It
      wouldn’t be the same as it was before, and no amount of pretending on
      either of our parts would make it so. And those kids didn’t ask to be
      here, so he should be with a woman who is going to be really happy
      becoming the stepmother to those kids. I’ve known women who tried to
      convince men with kids to dump their kids on their mother permanently
      and move away so they can live like the kids don’t exist. I’ve read lots
      of stories about men who try to convince women to do the same thing,
      though the kids usually get dumped on their grandparents. If I were
      really, really selfish, I’d have done that. But I’m not, and I wouldn’t. Maybe we should worry about those people more than the ones who just won’t date single parents.

      • John Q. Public

        I still see “ME ME ME”

        But thats ok. I would not want to partner with any person like this. Living a life of selfishness and capitalistic ideals is not sustainable or compassionate…therefore I space myself from those types of people.

        You can speak for yourself, but when you make broad, generalized statements as if they were fact, well, you are just being unskilled with your intention…rendering your response rather irrelevant.

        Live your life of ME ME ME and Im sure you’ll score a partner that thinks the same way.

      • Katarina Novak

        So do I but from you.

        You have to date ME ME ME, because I want a hot financially stable woman who has no financial obligations and hasn’t crippled her body with breeding!!!

        I can’t offer anything I demand but you have to date ME ME ME because my DNA is so awesome and you have to take care of MY MY MY kids!!!!

        You have to let ME ME ME fuck whenever I I I want because you’re a woman and you have to serve ME ME ME and you have no business having an oppinion of your own!!!

      • John Q. Public

        ” You have to date ME ME ME, because I want a hot financially stable woman who has no financial obligations and hasn’t crippled her body with breeding!!!”

        Wow! I can’t possibly see how you’d extrapolate that from what I’ve said.

        “I can’t offer anything I demand but you have to date ME ME ME because my DNA is so awesome and you have to take care of MY MY MY kids!!!!”

        Wow, again you sound bitter, angry and make wild assumptions. I’d never expect anyone to watch my kids, ever. My DNA? What the hell are you talking about? Get help.

        “You have to let ME ME ME fuck whenever I I I want because you’re a woman and you have to serve ME ME ME and you have no business having an oppinion of your own!!!” ”

        You are quite wrong and misled. I am an active supported of queer/trans/gay movements, cohort with many an anarcha-feminist and have no delusions as you’ve suggested. I’ve never stated you can’t have an opinion,l or even insinuated that. I said if thats how you think “ME ME ME” then you will attract someone that thinks the same.

        Now, with that said, I am of the camp that believes “hurt people hurt people” and I’m sorry you’ve been damaged by whomever in your life, but you will NOT project that upon me. Go away please.

      • Katarina Novak

        I’m not going anywhere, you patronising wanker. You’re the one, saying that women who don’t want to take care of other people’s kids, are living the life of selfishness and capitalistic ideals.

        I bet you can impress a few teenage girls with this drivel.

        The fact that you seem to lump the trans brigade with gay movements and feminism, is another can of worms though. That would require a whole separate discussion.

      • John Q. Public

        Patronizing? You’ve devolved into name calling because you have an incredible warped view on someone you’ve never met.

        ” saying that women who don’t want to take care of other people’s kids”

        I never said that. You’ve interpreted it because someone hurt you int he past and now you’ve taken to the internet in a sad, sad attempt to insult someone because you have a pentance for attracting assholes. No wonder you are single.

        And you off-the-cuff garbage about “DNA” ? Whats that? Subjective, barely-literate nonsense.

        Oh, I see, you are transphobic as well, yeah, what redeeming qualities do you have other than being a hateful, angry, illiterate twit do you have? Hmm? Care to contribute anything to this conversation, or are you going to solely focus on me? That says an awful lot about you.

        Impress a few teenage girls? You are disgusting.

        Sincerely, Happy not-single anymore, not expecting her to take care of my kid, and definitely LAUGHING with her by my side at YOU in your inconsolable madness, furiously pecking away at the keyboard in an attempt to save face….

        Disgusting Pig.

      • Katarina Novak

        Hello, Disgusting Pig.

        Yes, you did! The writing is on the wall.

        Why is it, that males like you immediately resort to the “no man wants to be with you” routine? What exactly do you think you’re going to accomplish?

        If you find it so difficult to understand my posts, may I suggest a spelunking trip into the dictionary of the English language? At the very least, you could find yourself some new adjectives, it would make you a little less repetitive. While you’re there, look up the definition of pentance.

        I now see that you really are that big of an idiot. If you actually believe that outfitting a man with a pair of tits and sticking him in a frock, can somehow make him into a woman, you’re a rather lost cause already.

        There it is! The obligatory laughing! Nice move with the addition of a girlfriend. Good luck with that, by the way! If she hasn’t damaged herself with breeding, her damage is of a more mental nature.

      • John Q. Public

        Consider yourself ignored by the way, I looked at your channel. Subjective garbage from a mentally disturbed, hateful, angry, lonely person.

      • Katarina Novak

        Answering all my posts, is not ignoring me.

        What channel? It’s a convenience account for miscellaneous fuckery.

        What is it with you and your fetish for subjective? It’s not a slur, in case you didn’t know. There is no such thing as a view from nowhere, all the views are subjective.

      • yessah3

        Sounds like you have some man hating there. You should honestly see someone about that. Not all guys are bad just like not all girls are bad.

      • Alice

        John there is something that really bugs me about your reply to these woman and I want to get it off my chest. You think they’re selfish for not wanting any kids and choosing to focus on other things and also themselves. When you think of it, what made you decide to have children?

        Because when you chose to create a child with your ex it was also all “me, me, me” based. You chose to create a life to add to your own happiness. You did that for you. And you did that knowing fully well that there is always a possibillity that a child might have to deal with serious illness of a lifeconsuming disability. You chose te create a life knowing that that life might be unhappy forever, wish it didn’t exist and not be happy with life at all. You took that risk because it would add to YOUR happiness. That too is a serious case of ME ME ME. Maybe even more so then the people who choose to focus on themselves because you involved another human being in it.

        I’m not saying this to hurt or be mean but I do want you to realise that just because someone made a different life decision than you, it doesn’t make you a better person. These women choose to not have children to focus on them them them and you chosse to have children for your your your happines. The simple fact that your child or children come with more responsibility doesn’t made it less selfish to have them. It was your own decision remember. So if you’re going to call childfree women selfish for their life choices, it’s only fair you acknowledge that you did the same with a different outcome and you don’t hold it against them.

      • John Q. Public

        After all of those paragraphs, you are still trying to justify the idea that there is NOT a double standard here. There clearly is. Its not the rule. But it is there.

        I don’t want to be around someone that is proudly “child free” – I’ve generally experienced people like you to be reactionaries and incredibly smug with your “choice’ and over a couple beers it usually boils down to a couple jokes about overpopulation, breeders, etc. Its a snotty way to live and people that use that type of language are clearly (as evidenced by the nasty responses I’ve gotten) egomaniacs. Not necessarily bad people, but certainly people that have some narcissism issues that I don’t have the patience for. But pointing out the hypocrisy, well, its there, whether you or anyone else decided to plug their ears and make noises that it isn’t. Its not up to you to decide. Its there, I’ve observed it, move on.

      • Alice

        Actually, I’m getting ready to become a mom so you don’t have to bite my head off. I too want to be a parent but I recognise that decision for what it is. A selfish move to make my own life better. And yes, I’m very much willing to take the risks I have described in my previous post. I think about it, I’m scared about it but I want a baby and I will give that little one my all. So with that out of the way.

        It’s not hypocrisy that makes these women not want to date you. It’s hypocrisy that you accuse people of something you yourself are just a guilty of as the rest of us. You have your own list of wants and deal-breakers when it comes to dating otherwise you would have long been happily settled with someone you won’t take into consideration now. We all have the right to choose who we want and to set standards. Just because you want to be a good dad and you love your children doesn’t mean the rest of the world has to love them too. Single mothers have a tough time dating as do single dads, that’s the reality of things. That’s a risk you took when you choose your children. And it’s a risk I’m taking myself. I hope I won’t but I might end up a single parent. It still doesn’t mean I’d be entiteld to anything.

        I’m sorry you’re so hurt and lonely. I’m sorry life made such a mess of you. As you said yourself, hurt people hurt people and you are hurting a lot of people by being so judgemental without seeing you yourself are guilty of the exact same thing. Everybody has a choice. Everybody has valid reasons for their choice. People with narcissism issues have children too and people that are very selfless and caring sometimes chosse not to. Simply choosing to become parents like we did/do does not make us better people. It only means we want something different from life and we won’t be a good fit with the child free people of the world.

      • John Q. Public

        I’m plenty happy, practice dharma and go running, eat healthy, live in a modest yet comfortable home 20 minutes from a ski slope. Maybe you are projecting? I also have a fiance and kids running around the house….things do change, things are temporary. The double standard exists and you dont see it because you dont want to. So.

      • Alice

        You do realize I never said anything about double standards being there or not in the first place. I only pointed out that you yourself were also using double standards when it came to calling people selfish for not having children and that it bothered me.

        You just came across as someone who was lonely and hurting because of how quick you were to jump at my comment but obviously you’re not and you’re happily engaged. So congratulations on that! And really, if it worked out so well for you, why are we even making such a fuss about woman who wouldn’t want to date you. Obviously you had no trouble finding a good one:)

      • John Q. Public

        You do realize that I never said you did, right? And you should also realize that the title of the submission you are commenting on (and in fact hunted down my comment to specifically reply to) is called “The double standard of single men with children” …right?

        How quick? It shows in my email. Don’t flatter yourself.

      • Coracreates


      • Hillari Hunter

        I’m childfree as well. I don’t want kids of my own, so why would I want to raise another woman’s kids? People can’t wrap their minds around women who don’t have maternal instincts; too bad. Ex-wife drama and baby’s mama drama aren’t a part of my world, and never will be. This is real life, not “The Brady Bunch”. Every kid doesn’t warm up to a stepparent and visa versa. Single men with kids would do well to keep looking for women who truly enjoy being around kids instead of complaining about those who aren’t interested in playing mama. They will NEVER change the mind of a childfree woman to take on their kids.

    • Coracreates

      I am 32 also – and a single mom. I agree with what you are seeking in a woman …as I would like the same traits in a man. Also someone who is mature, loves learning and life, compassionate (probably one of the most impt) and is genuine and true to himself. Someday….

      • John Q. Public

        Yeah, I think after I’ve been in this smaller town I’ve realized the “pool” is just pretty small here. C’est la vie…

    • Linda

      Except, you and your ex-wife enjoyed a long period of “me, me, me” together. That helped you to form the bond that lead to marriage.

      Anyone single woman you date now won’t be able to share that now. And she is acutely aware of this fact.

      Materialism is a different thing altogether. Although, for some women, if their man’s attentions are spread thin, and the emotional connection has gotten a little weak that’s the only visible way they can think of to get a little validation from their guy.

      • John Q. Public

        Thanks for the insight. Thats all I’m wanting here, also sharing my conceptions and apparent mis-conceptions and seeing what folks, mainly women in this situation think, because of course this isn’t an argument, as some (Katarina) might think. Thanks again.

    • Katarina Novak

      Should we call you a whambulance?

      • John Q. Public

        Golly, how absolutely profound.

        You know, you’ve really contributed nothing to this conversation but subjective garbage and petty mud-slinging. I try to find the value in everyone’s opinion even if contrary to mine, but you, you, simply sound like a bitter, angry person. Go away.

      • Katarina Novak

        I was restraining myself. I could have called you a manipulative tosser, for insinuating that women who don’t want to throw their lives away to take care of other people’s mistakes, are egocentric, materialistic and don’t love life, as well as spewing the forced positivity dogma at someone who disagrees with you, but I decided to take the high road. In retrospect, I shouldn’t have bothered.

        In light of your original post, your above accusation of “subjective garbage and petty mud-slinging” sounds particularly irrational. But you have to do a certain amount of mental gymnastics, in order to make yourself believe what you’re churning out.

        Once again, I’m not going anywhere just because you’ve got your fee-fees hurt. (I’m already anticipating the obligatory zen crap of a response)

      • John Q. Public

        I see your schtick now. You date assholes and get dumped, then go to the internet to call people names that have kids. What a sad, angry little pig you are.

      • Katarina Novak

        Names have kids? Which ones?

      • Coracreates

        I agree. She spews out toxic insults which add no value whatsoever. She is an example of what is wrong with a certain few in society.

    • cheeze.wiz

      Bs… If your chick picked her career over you and your brat you’d be pissed… So it’s all about you… You’re the selfish one

      • yessah3

        Good lord you would make a horrible mom.

      • cheeze.wiz

        We don’t all want to be mothers

      • yessah3

        Well at least you won’t have kid. I agree nothing wrong with not having or wanting kids. Something is wrong with those that choose to but have no intention of following through with it.

      • cheeze.wiz

        There are plenty of those

      • cheeze.wiz

        It’s not really an accomplishment to have a baby… There are plenty of women who’ll can’t handed children and adopt and raise those children with love… Children who aren’t their blood… So you’re an idiot

      • yessah3

        Maybe so, but you would still make a horrible mom. Given some of your comments, a horrible partner too.

      • cheeze.wiz

        I make no quams about it… But choosing to have children is uppity choice just like getting married. Doesn’t lamb those are the only things that lead took a fulfilling life. Relationships and children aren’t for everyone… That’s how it is

      • cheeze.wiz

        These internet is real life

      • randal

        I could give a rat’s behind how any woman feels about a man and his child/children…..could care less if she prefers to date him or not…the ONLY reasoning here is the fact that ANY dude whom decides not to support his child/children physically, mentally, emotionally, and financially is a REGISTERED, CERTIFIED BUM….

    • cheeze.wiz

      Also people who think money doesn’t buy happiness… Don’t have money… Never will have money… Or don’t know how to spend their money… So shut up

      • yessah3

        Wow, I hope you never have kids.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Kids are an excuse for people like you to act liked you’ve done something special…

    • Rose

      But if you could choose whomever you wanted to date wouldn’t you pick the best option? I’m not sure if I can speak for any other women but for me here’s a lot of options out there. I’m a women, almost 30, no kids (yet) and I signed up for a datingsite only 2 weeks ago. Up until now I’ve gotten over a hundred replys. That’s what you’re up against as a single dad. I can’t date them all so I make a selection. No college education, out. No job, out. Blonde hair, out. You’re a doctor? sounds too stressful and too demanding on your time, you’re out. And unfortunately for guys like you, kids means you’re out too. Even with all my criteria (and I’ve been nitpicky to the extreme) there’s still 4 guys left. Educated, good jobs, good looks and all wanting to have kids and start a family.

      For a single dad, there is just a massive amount of competition out there and as a woman I can be all about me because there are so many options. Maybe one of the single dads is the best person for me, I don’t know. But I can’t even begin to date everyone who wants to date me so I pick the guys that seem best suited to my wishes and my own situation in life. These guys give me the chance to do what you already did with your ex. Start fresh, experience the excitement of a first pregnancy together not knowing what will happen when the baby is born, buying our first home, taking a first family vacation, a first family Christmas. Those are things I’ve dreamed of my whole life and there are men out there who want to do it for the first time with me. At the end of the day, reality is you don’t get those precious firsts with someone who’s already done it with another woman.

      It’s those factors together that keep me from dating a dad. And I guess that is selfish but then again isn’t dating ever not. Everyon eventually wants to end up with the person best suited to their life and their wishes so if you’ve got the opportunity it’d be stupid not to take it.

      • yessah3

        Well said. Women definitely have the choice of being picky on those sites. I think it is like 100 to 1 ratio. LOL! The fact is you are ruling out a person, based on them having a kid. What if they really love that kid and are a great parent? Would that not show you more than anything how mature and capable of loving someone other than themselves they are? Single guys give you nothing. You won’t truly know someone until you have kids with them. The stress and time constraints shows you a person’s true character. Those single guys without kids may be great until you have kids. Then you may end up on that same site as a single mother in five years. Just food for thought.

      • Rose

        Just because someone already has kids doesn’t mean they’ll also be a good partner. Just because someone doesn’t have kids doesn’t mean they won’t be a great partner and parent. Second marriages with kids from a previous relationship have a much higher divorce rate than first, more than double even. Odds I’m going to end up on that same site as a single mom are much, much higher when I marry a guy that already has kids. As I stated, I can choose so I choose the best situation and statistically speaking, that’s not a guy with kids. That’s not to say I don’t appreciate a guy who’s a good dad and I don’t admire that. I do amd I respect that! But it’s just not for me.

  • AM

    This isn’t a double standard. It’s men finally getting a taste of a burden that has disproportionately affected women for a long, long time. You are not experiencing a single thing that does not also affect single mothers, but you don’t see that because women’s childcare role is taken for granted and selfless care is expected of her, while men feel they deserve praise and recognition for the same thing. Grow up. It’s a tough situation for all men and women who are single parents, but men do not have it worse. Try googling single mothers and have a look at the hate spewed at them.

    • Coracreates

      I agree! Very well-stated!

    • Rob

      Yes go ahead and google single mothers and look at all the websites and organizations geared towards helping single mothers and to support them. Then contact them and claim to be a single father in need of support. THAT is why it is a double standard. The writer never said single Moms don’t have it rough, yet you some how assume this. Plus the main point of the article is specific to dating, which reality is women are less likely to date a man with full custody of his kids, than a man is to do the same. The biggest problem single Moms have in that regard is finding a decent man among the heap. Men on the other hand don’t even get that many options to begin with

    • John Q. Public

      I agree with the former of what you’ve said, but the latter I wouldn’t apply to myself. I don’t think I deserve *more* praise than a single mom, or even equally so, as women have it hard in many other ways. But within the context of single fathers and dating, it boils down to the simple (and false) comparison that Single Moms generally can go out and find dates a LOT easier. Why? Its because…drum roll…men have lower standards in general. They want to dominate. To copulate. So….with that said, yes, women have in general more opportunities to have relationships, albeit more quantity over quality because of this simple, primal dynamic. I think thats at the core of the sentiment here, albeit not communicated very well. I just resent it a little, but again its how things are. Women that are single moms have to put up with a barrage of bullshit that comes with being an object of mans desire and the exploitation that can come with it, and that is doubly unfair.

      Now, if we go down the road of comparing our struggles, pain, suffering, we get nowhere, likely further divided. Each of our suffering is unique and deserving of recognition, not one over the other. That to me is unskilled and gets us nowhere.

    • yessah3

      I agree to some level. I think single fathers are experiencing something that effects more women than men. I disagree with the hate on single mothers. There is no thing in this world that is taken for granted more than fathers. Look no further than fathers day. The day with the most collect calls. Mothers are praised and given kudos. Fathers not so much. Things are changing though.

  • Coracreates

    Interesting new perspective. Long ago I really cared for and dated a man who had a child. I had absolutely no problem with it and seemed to fit right into their family dynamic. But, I think I was naive (before having my own kids) and couldn’t fully grasp what it’s like as I was too young at the time and inexperienced. I was 10 yrs younger than the man and 10 yrs older than his daughter. 🙂 It worked out well and even now I like the idea of dating a man with a child. If someone were a widow – that would do the opposite of scare me away. I love kids though…and I am now a single parent so it is even more appealing to date a single dad…but I have only had a few experiences with it.

  • schoolish

    Its so important to step back and get a sense of the bond that the biological parent has with their child first. The better the bond, the better the transition with the step-parenting. When I married my husband, a very wise person who knew of the situation asked me if I knew what I was signing up for. I stubbornly said yes, of course I do. The truth is I didn’t know anything at all!. I was dating a married man (one strike against the situation) he was a business man and NOT a family man which means that I had to be the full-time parent. Meanwhile, I was receiving payment via karma for having dated, (then married) this married man, and so I was stressed, confused, always angry and crying fighting, very unhappy etc.. ALL while having to raise his children. I tell this story because when we make irresponsible decisions like I did, the kids are the ones who pay the biggest price. The family unit, and the marriage becomes a mess and doesn’t feel blessed. GOD doesn’t put mess together, we do that ourselves and then wonder why god wont bless our mess. As the saying goes, when you know better you do better. God will show us where we went wrong if we ask him. Date Wisely, date slowly. Make sure he/she is divorced FIRST.Watch the bond with his or her children FIRST. If it is a secure bond, then you as a step parent will know your boundaries and feel more secure yourself. The worst thing that can happen is raising step children not knowing the child, or your boundaries with regards to that child. If the bio-parent is not leading, the marriage, or the family structure wont work. its that simple. If it even smells as if you are breaking up someone else’s family unit, it definitely won’t work when they come to you because god isn’t in that mess. He shows us our mistakes but then we still have to take the consequences. The best way to be a success is to learn from our own mistakes and then share our mistakes so that others do not go through the same pain. God may not bless our mess but we can still use it for good by using our mess to teach, uplift, and help others. All he needs is for us to own up to our own crap. Sometimes, we are too busy picking, judging and cussing instead of owning our own truth.

    • yessah3

      Single guys without kids give women nothing to base an opinion off of. I think you are 100% right though. Is he a good father. If so, he has a greater chance of being a good mate. Single guys give you no evidence of how they are. Take your chances I guess.

    • Brittny Sanders

      Ur words spoke volumes to me. Thanks for posting.

  • troubled single woman

    There is a single father I’d really like to date but for some reason he pushed me away…

  • candice

    I wasn’t expecting to be the first priority in his life. I was just a proper third wheel. I had to follow what him, his son and the baby momma were deciding. I also didn’t know how to behave with this kid. I wasn’t his mother and I couldn’t be his friend. If I was saying my opinion about something it would had been interfering with their parenting. That was making me feel as a forever outsider.
    It was making me feel awful every time he was talking about how fast his baby momma got pregnant. In two months that they were together she got pregnant twice and me even after a year I couldn’t. I was feeling inadequate as a woman and even the bad person because my biological clock was ticking and I wanted a kid of my own. I don’t want a single dad again. I want a guy that we can both build our future and both start a new family. Call me selfish if you want but I don’t want to feel bad again about wanting some simple things.

    • Katarina Novak

      I will call you logical. Your ex knows that being with single parents sucks, this is why he wanted a woman without kids.

      • yessah3

        It might be easier on him, or candice, but it can work. I will say that I would only date single mothers because I think single non mothers are immature when it comes to kids. They don’t understand. They haven’t had to turn their lives upside down in order to raise a child. In that sense they are clueless and naive and I am 100% certain it comes across as selfish. It may not necessarily be selfish though.

  • Rob

    I am a full time single Dad of 2 kids, 8 and 6. Have been raising them on my own for 5 years, and have spent majority of that alone. Women just flat out don’t want to even consider it. Plenty of excuses for sure, mostly I think it is biological, where men have an assumed parentage when having a child, women it is more personal, they feel it inside them, a part of them, and creates a bond that is hard to duplicate. First and foremost, finding a woman that is capable of loving a child like their own, is one in a million, and chances are slim.

    Now that is not to say a woman has to play Mommy, but at the end of the day we are a package deal, if you can’t love my children, it’s never going to work. Most women may be suprised to know that a priority in finding a mate is more about wanting to show our children how a man should treat a woman, with love and respect, especially men with daughter’s, then it is finding a new Mommy for them.

    As a single father I tend to over analyze everything I do, am I making mistakes? What can I do more? What should I do less? Are my kids learning the right things from me?

    For women reading this, consider the fact that a single full time Dad puts those he loves before himself everytime, and will do the same for you, it’s not that the kids come first, that is simply true of any functional parent. But that never means you come in last, we take that spot gladly, and care for all that we place ahead of ourselves.

    • Katarina Novak

      Date a single mother. Unless you know that dating single parents is a losing proposition, in which case, you’re an outright hypocrite.

      • Rob

        I have nothing against dating a single mother, any woman who is capable of loving my children as much as her own would be welcome. My statement is more an observation based on biology, men go into parenting, even with their own children with an assumption of the child being theirs. Even in a commited relationship, the possibility exists the child could not be theirs. For a woman it is different, the child grows inside them and is a part of them, and that creates a very special bond and connection with the child. When it comes to step parenting, it is far easier for men to assume that role as the leap is not as drastic, for women it is much harder to overcome that gap. There is nothing wrong with that, but it does make for a special rare woman that can do that.

      • Katarina Novak

        The bond often doesn’t happen immediately (my childed acquaintances insist on telling me their woes, since being childfree, I don’t judge them for hating motherhood).

        Anyway, I’ve apparently misunderstood the intent of your post. I meet a lot of single fathers who go for me and become insulting when I reiterate my policy of not involving myself with people who have kids.
        They don’t want to date single mothers, because they have kids of their own, and so boyfriend’s kids wouldn’t be their primary focus.

      • John Q. Public

        I see your schtick now. You dated a single parent and he dumped you. Hah! How pathetic you are. I’ve looked at your ‘channel’ on discus and its all furious disaffected garbage about hating children, and parents. What a waste of air you are. Truly a disgusting piece of human garbage you are. You’ll die angry and alone for sure. Pig.

      • Katarina Novak

        You’re a moron. I never date single parents.

        I must ask though, is this satire? You engage in a certain behaviour and then immediately accuse me of engaging in it. Are you demonstrating something or are you really such an idiot?

      • Taz

        Ppl with a room full of kids still end up dying alone. Dont get upset because she isnt too keen on dating single parents.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        As a woman I agree from the womb there is a bonding process that takes place. It’s funny I hear women who’ve had c sections say they experience depression after child birth much more often than I ever hear women who’ve had vaginal deliveres. I truly believe it’s something different about a vaginal delivery. I used the two birthing methods to say it’s something about a child not being a woman’s or a part of her immediate bloodline that’s difficult for her to connect with… For me it depends on the father and how he’s raising his children. Children do what you allow, and so does others. When a man stands up and be a man and put everybody in their place children, baby mothers, mothers, grandmothers whoever, it lets that woman who he’s dating know I’m a priority and Important, and it makes her more open to stepping into a mother role because she feels secure.

    • Mark

      You are right about the biological part. There are a few things that come into play here actually.
      Women are hard-wired from evolution to reject out partners children. The male used to hunt and provide for his family and the female would take care of their offspring. That also meant securing as much resources as possible and if a male already had kids to take care of those kids would take resouces away from the females own. The female instinct developed to get rid of the competition. You see the same in lions where the females do the hunting and providing and the males kill the offspring of other males to make room for their own. This day and age it’s a completely useless (and even difficult) trait but most woman still carry the “kill” instinct. It’s not something that logic can just overwrite. In some women it’s very strong and in others less so but the ones who can accept and love another womans children are technically freaks of nature. Which is actually a good thing these days, don’t get me wrong on that. It just explains why so many women have such strong feelings about the subject.

      The other factor is how out brains are hardwired. Men (generally speaking) derive much of their self worth from their social status, getting respect, being able to provide for their family and knowing that their woves find them attactive. A woman (again generally speaking) derives her self worth from her place in the family en her status in that circle. So at first she thrives because she is the centre of her partners world and later on when they have children together she thrives because those children need her. Stepchildren however will very rarely place a woman in that position beause she is not their real mom nor will that jeed be fullfilled by her partner who is (as he should be) more concearned about his children. What a lot of men consider shallow selfishness is actually nature kicking in causing hurt over a very important need being met. Obviously there are exceptions but the majority of women work like this and it’s something that can’t be helped. It’s as natural to a woman to accept anothers child as it is for you to not love you own. It’s evolution and it really can’t be helped. Unfortunately that does mean men often get the shorter end of the stick in situations with kids involved. Is that fair? No. Can these women change anything about it? Also, no.

    • yessah3

      Well said.

    • Jody

      If you were really willing to come in last you would do what is best for any woman and let het go to find a guy without kids that will treat her better than you will. You wanting to date is in itself putting your wants above her needs. Don’t lie and say you will come in last because all you do is prove that that is exactly what you’re not willing to do.

  • Old Skull


  • Forbidden Fruit

    What don’t you understand about “childfree”? If a woman doesn’t want kids of her own, she sure as hell isn’t going to want yours. Find someone who does. Your sense of entitlement is creepy.

    • yessah3

      The problem is childfree does not mean she doesn’t want kids. Dating sites are littered with women 30 somethings “child free” that actually want kids. The vast majority of women want kids. The vast majority of them probably shouldn’t have them.

      • cheeze.wiz

        But some of us are child free… Down to being fixed

  • pendragon05

    So what? The vast majority of single mothers cannot find a guy because most men do not want to get involved with a woman who is a single mother. So glad my husband and I are childfree.

  • Martina Decker

    I cannot stop laughing. The degree of whiny butthurt here makes me wonder if any of you would be interested in a lifetime supply of Preparation H. Of course childfree women don’t want your baggage, including dealing with whatever kind of bullshit stunts your ex likes to pull. Just explain why the hell you’d even want a woman who isn’t even remotely interested in your kids, anyway. Cheezus Grits, GTFOI already.

    • randal

      Those are men that make the mistake of believing that women are capable of loving men the way men think they should…men confuse love with nurturing….it’s not a woman’s role to “love” us. That’s reserved for our mothers and children…

  • Nicole Tran

    Men and women have the right to reject anyone for any reason. Not wanting to date a single parent is a perfectly valid reason to reject someone. YOU yourself admit that dating a fellow single mother would not be your first choice if you had the option of dating a “Golden Pegasus with no kids”, so why is it so hard to understand why a woman would not be interested in dating a single dad? If she wanted kids, then she would have already had her own. Most people aren’t interested in taking care of someone else’s kids, which is an inevitability if she gets into a serious relationship with a single dad with young kids. She will be expected to give her time, energy, attention and money to kids who don’t belong to her and who will be hostile towards her because they view her as an unwanted intruder trying to replace their real mother. The kids will never love or respect her like their real mother, because she is not their real mother and never will be, no matter how much she gives and gives to those kids. THAT is why childless and childfree women reject single dads. Most women would rather have their own kids or none at all than take care of ungrateful, angry and hostile non-biological children. The only situation in which I would reconsider dating a single dad would be if his kids were all grown up, independent adults who have moved out of their parent’s home.

    • yessah3

      Sounds very selfish to me. Single dads come with kids. I have no problem spending time with my girlfriends kids and she has no problem spending time with mine. Do I love hers as much as mine, of course not. But I am not ruling her out because of that. LOL!

  • Katarina Novak

    Poor baby! Hot, financially stable, clever women don’t want to be your maids/prostitutes/nannies/wallets.

    Who would have thought, that people who refrain from having kids of their own, don’t want to take care of and pay for someone else’s kids!

    I mean, what’s not to like? You’re offering a scintillating opportunity for a woman to pay for and take care of your kids, without having any authority over them, who will undermine her at every step for not being “their real mummy”.

    She would have to deal with a drug-addled baby-mama, who would feel entitled to stick her nose into her life because “ya livin wit mah babbys”. Babies’ relatives would of course, feel entitled to stick their noses into the relationship as well, in order to make sure that “kids come first”.

    She would be dead-last on the consideration scale and she would be expected to like it, for the privilege of taking care of someone else’s kids.

    What self-respecting, hot, financially stable, intelligent woman wouldn’t jump at the chance?!!

    • randal

      She would be foolish to take such a chance….until she becomes pregnant…lol…Unfortunately, 90% of men who made children didn’t want them anyway…I give much respect to fathers who take RESPONSIBILITY…not LIABILITY…

  • Liv

    I don’t date single men with children either. This article was about men who have their life together, know how to prioritize and try to make sure everybody’s happy. Up until now I’ve never seen a singel dad who was like that and I have seen quite a few relationships between single childless women and singel dads. I know they’re not all like that but seeing friends struggle with what is expected of them and sometimes even fall into depression because the pressure their husbands put on them concerning his kids does not really make me want to take the risk.

    Even if the man would have everything together I doubt I would be happy in a relationship with a dad. Apart from the possible baby-momma drama and always being an outsider to his family (no matter how well everybody blends together and how much you and the kids start to love each other, you’ll never be his kids mom and there will always be a certain distance and feeling left out of family things with his kids, or at least I was told by several woman who date dads) there are several issues that keep me from dating a dad.

    My core values revolve around marriage and family. To me, once you get married, you stay married no matter what. I understand that most divorces are instigated by women these days. Still, a divorced man, or a man who had children out of wedlock would be a dilemma for me, to say the least.

    Then there’s the part of being first. I do want to be first but I think a lot of people don’t really understand what that entails. When I am with someone, he’s my world. When I get married he will be the centre of my life, all of my my time, my money and my love will go to the life we build together. Everything would be us. I will give 100%. If he already had children from a previous relationship he can’t return that. If you go to a store and they charge you 80 bucks for something, you don’t go asking them if you can pay 100. I know it’s a poor comparison but I immagine it feeling a bit like that. Giving 100 to our family and only receiving 80 or less because he already has another one he has to take care of will eventually start to gnaw on you, no matter how loving or selfless a person you are. I don’t think it selfish of me to want to recieve what I put into a relationship. Most of those single dads out there started out on that basis with their exes. Equal parties in their relationships, why is it wrong of me to want the same?

    Then there is the issue of children. I’m not sure if I want them. The reason for this being that I’m not sure if I want someone in my life as important as my man. I think I might want to devote my life to our happiness together giving everything I have to my future husband for the rest of our lives. We could invest in us and our relationship. Travel the world, do spontaneous things, not having to care about money and living for the day. When a man already has children you can see where the problems could come up.

    If I decide I do want children that’s a whole different story. I want the best for my potential child. To me that also means having daddy every weekend and every day without having to share him with other children from a previous relationship. It also means not wanting my husbands money to go to another woman and her children. I want a college fund for my child. My parents gave it to me and I would find myself a pretty lousy mother if I wouldn’t provide the same for my own child. College where I come from costs about 250.000. It won’t be easy providing that kind of money on two salary’s for one child, let alone if my man would have to pay child support and possibly wishes to give his other children the same headstart. To me, the best for my child also means giving it the best start in can get financially, you don’t get that with a dad. Call me materialistic if you wish but I just want what’s best for my
    future child, just as you all want the best for your children.

    Life can be strange and unpredictable and I know I may end up as a single mom someday and still not be able to give my child what it deserves but I’d rather take a fighting chance than throw in the towel by dating a man with a child right now.

    I’m not saying these things to hurt anyone and I do hope you single men find good deserving women who will love your children. You and your kids deserve a good woman and you shouldn’t settle. I just think it’s unfair to call a woman selfish for wanting the things you’ve already had with you exes. Maybe think about turning it around and trying to see that it might not be entirely selfless of you to want to take those precious moments in a beginning relationship away from someone who could still have that because you’ve already been there and done that

    • randal

      Your perspective is well respected and quite understood…I certainly can empathize with you…just understand, and I can’t stress this enough, that the relationship you are seeking with a man is ALWAYS CONDITIONAL….the relationship you form with your children (I guarantee) will be UNCONDITIONAL….

      • cheeze.wiz

        That is not true

      • yessah3

        I actually agree on some level. Blood is unconditional. Blood is thicker than water as the saying goes.

      • cheeze.wiz

        No its not

      • randal

        This is the very reason men propose to women….the single, most important role of a husband is to LOVE his wife….

      • cheeze.wiz

        Are you mad at me? I’m confused

      • randal

        Not at all….Where would you have drawn such a conclusion?

      • cheeze.wiz

        It’s the internet everyone is mad haha

  • Taz

    Im a woman 25+ without kids I’m not even gonna entertain the idea of dating a baby dad. Maybe after 30 a divorced dad. We just couldnt relate to each other or be able to do the same things.

    • yessah3

      I think you hit the nail on the head. A relationship without similar lifestyles or interests is doomed to fail. One not having kids and not understanding the demands that entails will never work.

  • Dawn

    Another thing is this idea that women are called selfish because they don’t want kids. Wouldn’t the dads be selfish because most want a non mom because she can help support or babysit his kids. Single dads were the worst on dating sites. My profile stated no dads yet they contacted me and were almost always abusive, including death threats. I even had my first profile deleted on Plenty of Fish because of complaints. Yet these same men never date single moms. I know plenty of decent single dads but they aren’t online. Why? Because they find quality mates offline because they are realistic. Most married single moms. Online is another story with lots of entitled single dads. I no longer do online dating because of the harassment I endured. I’m 44 and have dated dads but will never do again even if it means a lifetime of cats. BTW I like kids, it’s not an issue with them but the ex and all the drama and financial. I don’t need someone that bad to deal with it.

    • yessah3

      If you think single dads are after a mom for their kids you are sadly mistaken. My guess is most single dads were verbally and emotionally abused by really deranged females who gave no love or emotional support. These guys are looking for someone to treat them and their kids nice, that’s all. When single fathers get the hint that a woman is selfish, it immediately raises red flags in him since he most likely has lots of experience with that with his ex.

      • Dawn

        WRONG! Most single dads weren’t the victims. SOME were the victim and these guys are often too gun shy to date again. The majority of the single dads I’ve come across got divorced for lame reasons. If they got no emotional support it’s because they were probably not good husbands. Yes these guys want women to treat them and the kids nice and by nice you must mean buy them things, babysit, etc. If a childless woman doesn’t want to date one it doesn’t make her selfish. In fact the single dad is selfish by going after a childless woman instead of a single mom and we all know why: either for her money or her to babysit. Been there, done that.

        If he truly wanted a nice woman to be nice to him and his kids we would date a single mom. Us childless women are onto you single dads and we know why many of you target us instead of single moms. It’s not because you want someone to treat you and your kids nice. It’s so we will give more than you can give. Then when we say no thanks you get angry. My online profile clearly stated no single dads yet so many of you didn’t read and got mad when I declined you. Why would I want a single dad when I can find a childless man or would rather be alone? Not one single dad has ever given me a good reason to date them. Love? I can get that from a childless man. Love from a child? well first off most stepkids don’t love their stepparents. Second I have a niece. Being part of a family? yes a family that usually includes the ex and her family. A family that may require me to help support. Financially security? Nope, not if he is paying child support and possibly alimony. This could mean I pay all or most of the household expenses. I may even have to help pay his debts.

        I’d like to hear a good reason to date a single dad and have never come across one. Responsibility? having a kid doesn’t mean being responsible. In fact it often means the opposite. Dating? it often means cheap dates or child friendly dates. No thanks, I’ll pass.

      • yessah3

        You do realize women divorce men about 70% of the time. So you were saying. I was one of those men whose wife divorced them. She did me the biggest favor. My life got so much easier without her. I did almost all the housework, spent more time with the kids, did all the yard work and shoveling, snowblowing, mowing, fixed things, etc… , she even had a nanny while she “worked from home” part time. Listen, not saying all guys are great, but I think women’s reason for divorce many times is a grass is greener type thing.

        I mean nice as in nice, not yelling, screaming, swearing, putting down in front of kids, insulting and general verbal and emotional abuse. Simple nice is all.

        What are you talking about. Guys and girls end up with people for all sorts of reasons. I think not dating a person just because they have kids for a man or woman is superficial and immature. Sure, it brings some added stresses, but we are talking about a person you may spend the rest of your life with. Seems small when you think about it like that.

        I never targeted a single mom for the reasons any man reading your post and many like them can gather. You are full of yourselves and think your worth is greater than anyone elses. I think you made that abundantly clear. Thank you.

        I can assure you by your response, stepkids won’t love you, but if you had kids of your own, they probably wouldn’t like you either.

        Hope your future partner doesn’t get cancer, you may have to pay for that too. LOL! You sound horrible.

        Yup, you are in fact a horrible person. Do men everywhere a favor and stay at home and raise cats.

      • Dawn

        Oh because I refuse to support a man’s kids I am a horrible person and should raise cats? I would prefer cats (and why do you men always mention cats ?) over an entitled jerk like yourself who has a grudge against women. You’re just angry because childless women can see right through you and refuse to cater to you and your kids. I don’t know or care why people get divorced but the guys I know who got divorced got divorced for reasons like they were to blame. Even if they were the victim that stinks but doesn’t mean you take it out on women like me. Most divorced men should still be married and expect us to accept that fact. A child deserves to have both parents but the fact is it is not natural for a child to have other people like stepparents in their life. They get confused and can’t handle it.

        And yes my worth is greater than a single dad because I don’t have baggage! I guarantee that women like me are in more demand because we don’t have baggage. That’s why you single dads gets angry we reject you. You know we have other choices at all ages and you don’t. Most of you are so broke and we know why you want us and not single moms. I’m far from selfish, I am very active in volunteering and donate to many charities but supporting a family not my own because the child’s parents couldn’t work out their problems isn’t my problem.

        Oh and what a jerk bringing up cancer. Not the same thing and yes I would help support a partner with cancer. You haven’t explained why I should support a partner with their kids and ex? Cancer is a disease they can’t help, having children is a CHOICE.

      • yessah3

        I never went after a woman without kids after my divorce. I found a woman with kids and she is awesome. I would never ask her to support my kids. I have only on one occasion asked her to watch one of my kids while I took my oldest to his basketball game. It was for a couple hours. Is that what you are talking about. LOL! I am independent and will remain that way. I will never marry again and she knows it. She has the same fears. Self entitled. LOL! I earned in spades everything I have. Nothing came easy. The divorce from my psycho ex, getting full custody of my oldest and probably full custody of my youngest when he figures out his mom is crazy. The years of abuse I dealt with at the hands of that lunatic every day without her is a blessing.

        Wow! My oldest wants nothing to do with his mom. She was physically abusive to him and was reported to DHS. Had two therapists agree he shouldn’t live with her and meanwhile she was accusing him of being crazy. Yeah, I should have stayed married to her. You are just as crazy as she was. I actually tried to stay married, hoped to god she got help but there was no getting through. She couldn’t admit wrongdoing ever. She never apologized ever.

        Believe me, you are not in demand. LOL! Guys can see right through you. Maybe you can fool some guy given you donate and volunteer.

        You might help, but my guess is you wouldn’t like it and would probably hold it against them. You should stay single and stick to cats.

      • Dawn

        Then if you have a woman why are you angry because someone like me doesn’t date single dads? I not only wouldn’t date a single dad but not a guy who is bitter like you. I have a lot of worth and judging by the quality men that I date (and I have someone who doesn’t have kids) I attract all kinds.

        Sorry but not your so called psycho ex. I just don’t date dads, I just wish them harm. However many of you have threatened me on dating sites, yet claim to be responsible, It’s also not my fault you married a psycho. It just shows you don’t choose wisely. I do, which is why I don’t date single fathers.

      • yessah3

        You choose wisely and yet you are still trying to find the one. LOL! You will be trying for a long time. The problem isn’t them, its you.

      • Dawn

        Nope, I found the one and guess what? HE HAS NO KIDS, and doesn’t believe in sex before marriage. Imagine that.

  • Christopher Herzig

    I am a real single dad here with 2 kids that does all the work himself. If his mother is raising the kids he’s not a single dad. I never planned to be doing this and have had to make a ton of sacrifices.

    I am guessing that most men that find themselves alone with kids are really looking for a life raft. I know I have trolled okcupid more than once on a hard day. It’s really really hard. Men are not natural mothers and kids need a lot of mothering. It can be done but us guys have to work at it and it’s not fun for us.

    Their are handful of us that have their lives together and have their homes working for both themselves and their kids. They are rarer than a Unicorn at 711.

    Any man that would make the sacrifices and commitment that it takes to raise kids on his own is one hell of a guy and I would think worth going after.

    I don’t look for relationships anymore. All of the Woman I have meet over the past 4 years have wanted to be put first above my kids. They seemed to care only about themselves. It’s a wonder they are all still single.

    • Hey Chris, keep your head up brother. It was for dads like you that I penned this article because it is the reality of everyone’s situation. There are so many comments from women on this article alone that reinforces what you’re saying and it’s extremely sobering. Thank you for what you do, and your children will make it all worth it in time. Love is complicated and shallow as hell, but there are women out there that aren’t as basic as pattern is showing and I hope that one comes your way. Thanks for coming through and telling us your story. Stay strong and all the best.

    • Roslyn Mendez

      Is it wrong for a woman to want to be put first? The reality is we know we can’t, but it doesn’t mean our mate can’t make us feel like we’re first. In my opinion, but I am a woman, it’s not fair to a woman with no children to have to go without or lack because of choices a man made in his earlier life. If a man can’t make the proper accommodations to date a woman without children then he obviously shouldn’t pursue her, I’m not saying you. I feel like women with no children get labeled by SOME men with children. I’ll just say when a woman is peaking her 30’s or higher and don’t have children expect her to not know the struggle of a single parent because all she knows is how to put herself first. She doesn’t have anyone to pick up and drop off at school or cook for; her life is simply about her, so if a man with children choose to date a woman without make her feel just as important as your children and most importantly include her and encourage your children to also incorporate her into the already made family that you created. It’s a sad and lonely feeling to feel like an outsider in your relationship or unimportant. Nobody wants to compete with a man’s 19 children. We rather take a rain check.

      • yessah3

        Here is the thing, if you want to be put first above his kids, that means you would want to be put first above your own kids. You would make a horrible mom. Guys with kids and psycho selfish ex’s can spot this a mile a way. I can see a guy leading you on for sex but having no real interest in you because quite honestly, he knows you would be/are a horrible mom.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        Let me stop you at horrible.. I said I want to “feel” that way. If you had a husband or wife, which ever you prefer would you not want to “feel” like youre one of the most important people in their world, probably. Youre a dumb ass that was so eager to comment you didn’t even read the post properly. Read to understand and not just to reply idiot.

      • Gemma

        That’s redicilous. Before I got married I didn’t date guys with kids and one of the reasons was, I wanted to be first and foremost in his life. Now that I am married and had my first child she does come first. Just because a woman won’t take a backseat to someone else’s kids does not mean she won’t take last place for her own child. That’s called evolution.

      • Dawn

        I see one of the male trolls who attacked me also attacked you. He claims he is dating a single mom yet makes comments like we’ll make bad mothers or that we are evil or will be alone. What he doesn’t get is that many women either don’t want kids (and this is growing), or only wants her own. I don’t know many childless women who wants a dad. The majority I know who date dads either do so because they met in person and he’s amazing in every way (good job, in shape etc) or she was getting older and desperate and believed he was all she could get. Most of the women I know who dated single dads were unhappy.

        These men don’t get that we don’t want to take a backseat to his kids in anyway and that we don’t have a natural love for them. Some women will eventually like the kids and are fine with coming after them but not most women. It’s not the same as having kids because then they are OUR kids together, They don’t get that why aren’t interested in not having our needs meet because he is busy with his kids.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        Omg you said it best. It is very difficult in top of every excuse is “the kids.” In my situation, I felt as if I was forcing a relationship with the son who clearly wanted his mother. He was very annoying, sneaky, and manipulative. Everything his father did for me he felt had to be done for him; he literally watched me like a hawk, quite naturally making me feel uncomfortable. It’s a lot to adjust to fit into someone else’s already created world. As the single people, we have to alter literally everything, but we’re “selfish and unfit.” Relationships are give take not just take. I cannot imagine walking on pins and needles to fit into someone else’s world. Whoever Mr. miserable is, he is on a personal, BITTER rampage clearly, and he won’t get me down internet bullying. Everyone has options and opinions as we should; they build character and draws the line between individuality, so I hope you didn’t feel any ounce of remorse or sadness over his comments.

      • Dawn

        Not at all, I am numb to men like him. When I did online dating I had literally hundreds of men like him contact me. All of them were bitter. It was kind of funny because most of them would send compliments (thinking I would change my mind). I would either say something like thank you or thank you but still not interested, good luck. With the guys I just said thank you most of them would ask questions and then I would shoot them down. Then these guys would say something like “you’re ugly” or you’re a b. They NEVER took no for an answer,

        Every so often I would get a guy who would say “I know you don’t date dads but I am an exception”. Some of these guys were an exception (a few were widowed, and one guy adopted a child as a single dad). These exceptions were a small minority. Then there were the guys who felt they were the exceptions because the kids were grown, they never saw the kids, etc. I know some will date dads of grown kids but I won’t because they can be as much trouble. Never seeing your kid is scummy. The most bizarre exception was a guy who had a bunch of kids with different women and because he didn’t see or support them made him childless! Yeah right, it just made him a sleaze.

        I know many single dads and the ones I know who date single moms are generally not the ones contacting childless women. The ones contacting are the bitter ones who are angry their spouse left and hate women. They hate single moms especially and think they deserve childless women to “start over”. Sorry but bed made.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        I replied to your comment.. But it isn’t showing. You’re absolutely accurate. People need to cut it with the bitter shenanigans. Nobody plans to be single parents just as no one plans to be part of an already made family, so I’m sure if single parents could choose they wouldn’t be single parents. I guess they’re upset we still have that choice.

      • Dawn

        That’s what it boils down to. I don’t know many childless people who avoid single parents due to judging them. To some extent I do, because too many have multiple baby mamas/baby daddies but most here are divorced from one person. However, most people I know who don’t date single parents do so for a reason.

        I had a horrible experience and realized it wasn’t for me. Not to mention I know the laws and have seen stepparents get stuck supporting the kids and the ex and I’d rather avoid. Not to mention the drama and everything else. I am very polite when I turn down a dad but they are never polite to me. Most of them feel I “owe” them or am entitled to date me. No one is owed anything when it comes to dating. They call me selfish (though only seek me out because I am childless), they call me a gold digger because I expect nice dates (and I’m not opposed to paying but going on dates where I have to pay if I want something nice gets boring fast).

      • Alice

        Don’t forget the guys who feel like they’re better partners than an unchilded guy. Reality check, just because you have a kid you care for does not make you a better partner. You’re the same guy as you were before you had kids only with less time, less freedom, less money and more responsibilities and drama. These guys don’t want to acknowladge that. They feel somehow superior because they’ve had kids and now they understand “the love”. Too bad those guys are only interested in showering that love on their kids leaving their women with the emotional leftovers. How dare we be so selfish to decline?

      • randal

        You’re right!!…You have every right to decline…lol…to validate your point even more I’ll leave you with this….Did you realize it’s not expected for a woman to love a man? I’m not suggesting she shouldn’t love her man/husband….but this is really the ROLE of a man….to love his woman/wife…A woman doesn’t marry a man because she loves him…she marries a man because HE loves HER….Now, this is the reason we propose and put a ring on it….

      • Dawn

        Very true. Unfortunately that stereotype exists because of all the articles saying a dad is better than a unchilded one. I’ve seen these articles everywhere and the dating sites have several of them. One of the reasons they give is he is more responsible. Really? a guy who had babies out of wedlock carelessly or chose badly (and I know not not all dads chose poorly but many did)is better than a guy who either abstained from sex or was careful who he had sex with (and used protection)? Sounds like the opposite. I know many dads who are irresponsible (and something like 60% don’t pay their child support). Meanwhile a guy without kids usually is supporting himself and working hard to do so. Sure he might be selfish with his money but it’s going to him not others.

        I’ve had so many guys tell me they were better than unchilded men and the reasons they gave were everything from responsibility to “they know love” (apparently I don’t and neither does any unchilded person). They even told me they were better because they knew they needed someone. Huh? That sounded like they needed someone to support them. Yes someone to babysit or pay their bills.

    • Jane

      This is honestly one of the most disgusting things I’ve ever read. Women don’t always enjoy taking care of the kids either. It’s not fun for a man to look after his kids. Come on! It’s a lot of work and no fun for a woman either.

      There are loads of guys AND woman that take care of their kids by themselves and have their homes and jobs running smooth. That’s nothing special. You’re seriously on here trying to make yourself out to be so special while all you’re doing is taking responsibility for your own actions? Are you for real? You’re cleaning up your own mess and you want people to applaud you for it? If that’s all it takes these days let’s give a big hand to all the murderurs, rapists, childmollesters and other criminals of the world who turned themselves in to the police and are currently serving their punishment. After all, they’re not having much fun either but they are taking responsibility for what they did. And apparently you’re one hell of a person if you do that.


  • RaquelRain69

    Don’t trust all men with kids 910 he still with Bm

    • Brittny Sanders

      This is the truth I am single mom and my ex was cheating on me with a new woman and was lying to her about us and i found out and kicked him to the curb and then i found out i was pregnant with our 3rd and i told the other lady and Guess what she still got pregnant by the DUMMY so we were pregnant at the same time but her baby was due 2 months after mine. It sucks. And this will be her first and his 4th. A damn shame. Some women settle just for a piece of dick. DON’T SETTLE FOR A MAN OR WOMAN WITH KIDS IF THAT IS NOT WHAT U WANT IT only hurts YOU AND THE FUTURE KIDS U HAVE. I am a living witness to this. and now guess who is paying for all the selfish choices THE KIDS

      • Julie

        This is exactly what every woman has been trying to get across on here. Thank you for being a voice of reason and I’m so sorry for what happened to you and your children.

        I don’t understand how any woman can be so stupid to start a family with a man who already has one. It’s just as you said, it’s not just your kids who are going to pay the price but hers as well. That’s bad parenting at it’s worst but unfortunately many single dads are incapable of understanding that a good woman will put the future of her prospective children above his wish to date. To me that says more about how selfish and immature the guy is than it does about the woman. These guys can’t even grasp that I find my future children more important then him and yet they demand I understand their children are more important then me and they should be given a second chance. At the expence of my first chance, I might add, but they feel they are much more deserving of their second go around the block then any woman is of a first chance. Most of them are entitled jerks, as you might have noticed from the comments here. You’re much better off without that type of jerk that left you for another woman. Honestly, I’d take him for all he has and then wait until the new girlfriend is fed up with all the money that goes out of her family and into yours. Someone with such low values and low self esteem doesn’t deserve any better.

  • cmanny

    Chris I feel your pain! And thanks Craig for starting this thread.

    I’m 30, full time single dad. 3 year daughter. I have to agree with you that it sucks. Things will not get better until you change what you focas on.

    To any single dads out there reading this my advice to you is this:

    There will always be selfish, shitty women out there. (You obviously don’t want to date them anyway.) There will also be the smart women out there that held out from getting knocked up so they could go on to have a traditional family when they are ready and meet Mr. Perfect. (They are clearly more responsible and off the table.)

    So unless you have a missile to seek women that cant have kids or you spend your life swiping through dating apps/sites and going on terrible dates your options are gone!

    Thats right I said it, it took me a long time to decide. I was a successful business man, attractive, fit, with no ambitions for marriage/family but mistakes happen and we didnt wear condoms. You (and I) chose to take the higher road and be dads for our kids. Thats the decision we made, not to have fantasies of falling in love and having happy ever afters.

    Man up, wipe your tears and try again when your kids are grown up on out of the house. This is the crule punishment you have given yourself for being so reckless.

    Focas on being the best dad you can! That connection will fill some voids. Be a good friend to your friends. Having lots of friends and people around you is great for filling that void too. Some other ways to fill that connection/love your missing, go outside close with nature, faith/prayer, exercise etc..

    Once I realized that the dating game is over, life got soo much easier. Depression fades and makes spending time with your kids, family, friends and loved ones much more enjoyable.

    Also, I noticed that when your not focased on why women dont want you, you tend to focas on areas you can control like your carreer, your body, your health, your finances, your contribution to society!

    So, much like Chris And I (My name is Chris too) you have to give up on dating.

    • randal

      I understand you completely bro. My little girl is 11 and has been in my custody 11yrs…I couldn’t fathom her not being in my home where I can raise her. The longer your child is with you the more you’ll realize women aren’t capable of loving men the way we think they should….oftentimes, that “love” we think they are sharing gets confused with nurturing…Again, the love of a parent and child is almost ALWAYS UNCONDITIONAL…The “falling in love” relationships are ALWAYS CONDITIONAL….

    • MGTOW

      Women suck anyway dude. They are much worse than children. I’d rather have to take care of ten screaming and whining children than one screaming and whining woman. At least children are reasonable. Children have shame. These women today are a menace to society. They are incorrigible. They must be avoided. I make a point to look as unattractive as possible. I havent trimmed my beard nor had a haircut for over a year. Unfortunately for me when I make eye contact with women, it gives them the tingles. So I make an effort to never look them in the eye. Which women mistake for lack of confidence which works in my favor. I am also vigilant in avoiding expressing any qualities that women might view as attractive. This doesnt stop all of them. Women are becoming increasingly desperate for male attention. They back me into corners sometimes, forcing me into conversations that lead nowhere. I never let on that I notice their advances. I pretend that I am completely unaware of human sexuality. I am often accused of being gay for not advancing their bs conversations. I act extremely insulted. Then assault them with a tirade of shaming language. These tactics may read as extreme but I assure you they are most certainly necessary. At any moment a woman can slander you without fear of reprisal. Few of them would shy from the inclination. We live in a world that is HOSTILE to men and children. We must stand our ground and never do women any favors EVER. We have to stop feeding this beast. Pay them no attention.

    • Larissa

      This is the first intelligent comment from a man I’ve read. I’m 34 childless and I’m tired of men with with children seeking me out. I feel like a commodity. I’m tired of being searched by them and they act all wonderful in the beginning but as soon as I commit they try to change me so I fit into their lives and their children. They don’t “love” me. They screwed up and now they want a fresh start. It takes a lot of work. I’ve been lied to by people with kids saying they. Want more kids when they didn’t and wasting my time. They have all these unrealistic expectations. I’m tired of being unappreciated, used and being told I need to change. They ONLY way I would EVER consider dating a dad is if we met in real life and he was extremely attracted to me before knowing I didn’t have children. I want someone who loves me not some selfish jerk looking for a fresh start!

      • yessah3

        Do you think only single dads are selfish jerks? Sounds like it. Believe me, jerks take all shapes and sizes, colors credes and sexes.

      • Larissa

        I think single dads who seek out women who have never had children are selfish jerks. Not all single dads do that. Some realize that they have more in common with single moms and date them. Single dads that think they are too good for single moms are Hippocrates and jerks.

      • Brittny Sanders

        U opened my mind to alot of things. I am a single mom but I now see its not all peaches and cream to be without kids cause the guys see u as a fresh start/new mom. GEEZ it all blows

    • Brittny Sanders

      Damn i’m a single mom and this has helped me. Thanks for posting this up

  • Alice

    It’s the statistics and facts that scare me. Of second marriages 70% fail. When you enter a second marriage where neither partners has children the failure rate is only 15%. You do the math on the failure rate on marriages where one or both partners already have kids. That’s one massive impact those children have.

    Then there is a scale that psychologists use to “mesure” happiness and the way life events influence it. People who divorce and don’t see their kids again go down by about 1,5 points. That’s a lot. Woman who date men that have kids go down by 2-2,5 points. In other words you never having contact with you offspring again would hurt you less then it hurts a woman you date/marry to have your child in her life. It’s no wonder the one of the biggest groups of people who use anti-depressants and commit suicide happen to be stepmoms.

    Statistics don’t lie. Willingly driving someone into depression and possible suicide is not love. I think some of the men on here are extremely selfish for being so willing to do that to a woman because they just don’t want to be alone.

    Having children in the first place was all about you. You wanted a child so you had it. You made a life, not knowing if it would be healthy or happy or if it would have a good life to look forward to. How is that any less selfish than choosing not to have a child. If anything it’s more selfish because you could end up making something you created for your happines completely miserable. Maybe not having children is selfish but then so is having them. And then wanting someone to put up with those children, especially if you know those statistics is much worse than just deciding not to get inbolved with that.

    • Dawn

      Alice I didn’t know that about stepmothers but it makes sense. Out of all the non childed people who married parents only one was happy. This was a case where the other parent was out of the pictures. The others all divorced.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        That was the case in my relationship. It’s worse when there are multiple children.

      • Dawn

        I hope you’re out of that. I avoid dads because of it.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        I am. I was actually really torn because he was idea but the situation wasn’t. He did what he knew to make me feel important, but I couldn’t get with his son. The son annoyed me, and the fact that he seen nothing wrong annoyed me too!

      • Dawn

        Yeah that’s what happens and it’s sad. Luckily I never married the guys but I saw this often and it drove me nuts. Not to mention the ex,ugh I had dealings with this guy’s ex and she was insane. She would have gone after me and my money.

      • yessah3

        Wow, the more I am reading these responses the more I see what the author is saying. Maybe the women without children is not by choice, maybe men have avoided having children with them.

    • yessah3

      Alice, are the stepmoms adults? Are they prisoners without personal choice like prisoners? I am confused. You act as though they didn’t chose the situation they ended up in and only the dad is selfish. You need to understand life is full of choices, being a dad, being a mom, being a stepmom or stepdad, or being single. Your choice, unless you live in some third world country.

      • Alice

        Well Yessah, you have a good point there. The main problem with these things is, a woman doesn’t really know what she’s getting herself into. She knows her guy has kids, she knows they come first but she’s in love, underestimates the situation, thinks that she can handle it and by the time she realises what kind of emotions the whole situation elicit in her she alteady loves the guy and has a steady relationship making it very hard to leave. So yes, these woman are adults and they have a choice but it’s pretty difficult to leave a man you truly care about so they stick around and worst care scenario, end up killing themselves. That’s the problem with feelings. You can’t just flip a switch to turn them off and you can’t predict how you will feel beforehand.

        So yeah, I do think single parents are selfish if they try to force someone into dating them who really doesn’t want to. I think single parents are the selfish ones if they refuse to be understanding towards their partners and the fact that their children will cause negative feelings of resentment and anger. The women behind these statistict certainly did NOT choose the situation they’re in. I choose not to date parents because I happen to know these statistics. Most people don’t know. Honestly, I do feel that the unchilded people who get stuck with a songle parent are the biggest vistims here. And I do feel that single parents are incredibly selfish for dating people who don’t have kids

      • Jill

        I almost took you seriously when you mentioned those women are free to make their own choices. Too bad you, a lot of other guys here and the writer of this article are trying very hard to bully women into dating guys like you. Where is that freedom you talk about because all I can see here is women either submitting and dating a dad or being villinized for choosing not to? If women have a choice, then they shouldn’t be called names (like selfish) if they make that choice.

  • Roslyn Mendez

    I am a woman with no children pushing 30, and for nearly the past year, I’ve dated a single father of two, a boy an a girl. I have to be honest; it had its pros and cons. My issues were, although we had known each other for three and a half years before actually dating, I didn’t know his children. I had only met them a handful of times. My mistake! When I actually started dating him, I immediately noticed things I didn’t like about his children and overall things he allowed. Being a single father, I don’t expect him to know how to play mother, but it’s an major issue for me when a man allows his 9 year old son to speak in baby voice to him, that was one of the major things that annoyed me. The next thing that annoyed me is that he rarely spent time with all of us together, and it made me feel like an outsider. His excuse was he doesn’t want to allow his children to bombard my space, but how can you want to spend the rest of your life with someone and rarely bring your children around? He always had excuses for the things his children did that weren’t the most flattering. We had totally different views when it came to raising children which ultimately made me feel uncomfortable to say anything to his children. As much as I love kid, I discipline them in very sternly. I believe children need it, everything starts at home discipline them at home or the world will that’s my motto. Next thing was I often felt like a sitting duck, just waiting. When he would leave to go separately spend time with his children, me being single, it made me feel like ok I’m just waiting on him to be free, not my definition of a family. He was very good at making time for me, that was a pro, but I felt like no matter how good me and him were he still had two children that weren’t going away that in my opinion requires a lot due to the lacking presence of a living mother. He didn’t think it, but anytime a parent is missing it leaves a void. Lastly, his son was very standoffish and constantly mentioned his mother, which wasn’t necessarily a problem because she’ll always be his mother, but I felt he would say it as a reminder to me that he had a mother. I was once a child who lived in a single parent household and of course my mother dated, and I know how sneaky and manipulative children can be when it comes to sending out indirect messages. I didn’t know how to handle dealing with someone else’s half grown babies, so I chose to walk away from the relationship. I just felt like I didn’t have the patience to wait on the son to come around or for my mate to decide when he wanted to be a family. I expressed to him, in my opinion we did the dating thing wrong. As friends, I should have been getting to know his children. He wanted me to play the mommy role, in my opinion with strangers. Yes, they were children, but I didn’t know them and they didn’t know me, so they were guarded and so was I. If we shared some of the same parenting views, I truly believe we could have lasted longer, but how long do you stay in an uncomfortable situation? He was the whole package, but the situation wasn’t. I started to become unhappy and as time went on I started to feel like things were at a stand still. Because we weren’t married, I figured why marry into an unhappy situation. Single fathers are there any pointers you can provide me with that could have helped me in this situation? I really want to know what I could have done differently.

    • randal

      I’m a single father of an 11yr old girl and she’s been with me since day 1…No, you did just what your spirit told you to do so there isn’t anything wrong with that. I will say that the love a parent has for a child is almost ALWAYS UNCONDITIONAL …the “falling in love” relationships are ALWAYS CONDITIONAL…

      • Roslyn Mendez

        And that’s great because if I had them I would love them unconditionally as well, but if my spouse and I didn’t work for any reason, I would surely make my new mate feel welcomed and just as important as my children. Nobody ask to be a single parent just like nobody really wants to be part of an already made family, so let’s do the best to make it work. If children weren’t involved and your significant other didn’t feel important, trust they would leave after so long, mentally and then physically, so I wish people would cut the shenanigans. Note I stated “feel” like for a reason. Little gestures go a long way.

    • Brissa

      I’ve faced the same scenario. We are great as a couple and have lots of fun and work like a well oiled machine. However, I do have a child of my own and feel things should be fair for all the children involved and it seems his get away with everything cause he always wants to get to the bottom of things. I’m sorry ,but “I miss my mom” doesn’t replace my child’s clothes or toys or other things his son breaks. And I simply don’t believe that EVERYONE (classmates, siblings, teachers, etc) are bullying your kid – maybe its a reflection of passive parenting. Although I have no real issue with the children themselves mentioning to him that this behavior is a problem makes him withdrawn and distant from me which causes most of our hiccups. Not to mention that at times I feel like a sitter rather than a partner, mostly cause my disciplinary input isn’t heeded and his children always have a scapegoat. Overall he is a fantastic provider and person, but the parenting thing escapes him since he’s got guilty parent mentality which is ultimately detrimental to the children cause the world isn’t gonna stop to understand their behavior. My daughter notices that she has rules but the other two don’t and I can’t expect her not to cry injustice if it is. He’s definitely got a lot of pros but the con is not gonna change.

      • Roslyn Mendez

        Have you tried having a conversation with him concerning his passive parenting. I’m a very outspoken person, so this was one of my attempts. I sat him down and voiced to him my concern and how I felt it was dampening our relationship. I told him that I understand how difficult it could be for a child lacking the presence of a parent, I myself experienced it, but that does not give the other parent reason to pacify the child/ children. I used my experience, coming from a single parent household, to illustrate my point that it doesn’t matter how much you give to a child you will never be able to fill the void of the other parent. When that child grows up, he/ she will say I had an awesome mom or dad and it’ll be followed by a but, and that but will be followed by the child expressing how much hurt lacking the other parent presence caused. All he can do is his part; it doesn’t mean to give them a pass because of their situation. They’re not the first children and won’t be the last lacking a parent; I feel the best thing a parent can do for their child is teach them. If you don’t the world will; if you don’t teach your children responsibility or let them know how the real world is you’re setting them up for failure. I would also let him know that I won’t walk on egg shells around your children just as I discipline mine that I birthed and love yours will get the same. There is no special treatment. After I posted this, my boyfriend and I were in a really bad place due to the children situation, but after I was firm on how I felt, he got with the program. It was either that or lose me; I couldn’t imagine spending my entire life in an unhappy situation. I was happy with him but overall unhappy with his situation, that wasn’t changing anytime soon. I understand how situations like this can put you between a rock and a hard place; they become stressful, but I’d suggest a serious sit down followed by a layout of what you will not tolerate. Him getting in his feelings is his paternal nature, naturally people hate when others say anything regarding their children, but oh well you’re in a situation together. He’s not alone; whatever he dealt with with the children’s mother you are not her and he needs to stop punishing his children first and then you. Rather he knows it or not what he doesn’t teach them and what he allows that he shouldn’t will eventually become a punishment. He altering the mindset of his children to not be able to take ownership for their actions, a victim attitude. This would be my suggestion everybody is different this was an approach that worked for me because quite naturally you don’t want to lose someone you love and that was the place we were.

  • singleme

    I have four kids ,I am financially stable and it was always my dream to have a large family but all things change , I have to say I really enjoy my kids and really love being a father I’m lucky enough to spend all of my time raising them, yes it’s hard and all my time is dedicated to them…yes they are kids, and they are not perfect I worked in juvenile justice so had experience before i had them,.. and I also dated a woman who had a son he was like my first child I never wanted to have kids until I had a relationship with her son we became extremely close . …I didn’t screw up my life,..but now that I’m single I date single I have my family covered if I meet someone it’s me meeting someone,….. kids are never open to that, many things have to happen between me and the person I’m dating they are aware I’m raising a family on my own the kids mother is still in the picture she is more focused on her own life “no judgement”,.. so yes that is my priority ,…I’m on some dating websites I’m an athlete and work with high level athletes men and women ,.so I’m current lol.. I’ve been stopped in mid convo if they didn’t read my profile and literally say wow!! I can’t handle that ..that natural motherly sense of understanding is a rarity now I believe. .. I have to admit though it’s a shame I don’t have a partner to witness and share how much they are ,….on top of all that they have to be the right fit on a one on one bases , so I’ve excepted the fact that I am just limited to having brief encounters but open to more if I happen to find that dime piece that’s the right fit ,..that’s all I got guys I feel for some of these great dad’s on here much respect!!! … just one thing , my 3 daughters and my son I love you and you always come first until my last breath , always Dad 🙂

  • Shelly

    I told my dad I wanted to date a single father. Dad told me that guy had better not go near me because I deserve better. He told me I’d never be first with this guy and I shouldn’t date him. Obviously he was right.

    I can asure you my 66 year old father is not crazy young. Wonder how many dads on here are going to call their daughters selfish when the time comes they don’t want to date a single dad. Bet most guys on here won’t be jumping for joy to find out their babies have to take a back seat to some other womans kids.

    • Dawn

      My dad said that too. I have dated single dads, some were even friends with my parents and they had too much baggage. My mom told me to avoid single dads because she doesn’t want any heirlooms to go out of the family. They are both right.

  • SingleDadChildrenFirst

    I am a single father. I have no desire to date or meet a woman. The events that lead to me to becoming a single father also brought me to come to terms with the realization, that modern women are narcissists. They are relentlessly selfish. They are incapable of love, for to love someone you must put that person’s interests above your own. Modern women are incapable of this. Evidenced by the widespread acceptance and practice of (inutero-matricide)Abortion and prostitution, women would just as soon throw their own children in a trash compactor as they would spread their legs for money to buy shoes. My childs well being is way to important, for me to allow her to fall under the influence of one of these despicable modern women. And for what? A “relationship”. Which is code for ‘anything and everything that happens in your world must revolve around HER until she says so and sex’Thats why modern women dont want single Dads. They know that any man nowadays that fought hard enough to get custody of his kids must really care about them. Single dads dont have the time or patience for that kind of selfish bullshit. A real father knows when his child’s interests are being compromised. He wont fall for it. Modern women want absolute control. They wont share you with ANYONE. As far as a modern woman is concerned, you are her property. She expects your absolute attention and affection. She needs to control you. Manipulate you. She cant do that if you care more about your kid than you do her. She is deranged. Clinically speaking, the modern woman can be described as a malignantly narcissitic sociopath with violent tendencies toward others, especialy men and children. Any father that cares enough about his children should beware. Modern women represent a clear and present DANGER to the health and well being of innocent children all over the world. Do your part. Avoid women at all costs. Let them rot in their catfarm shantes.

    • Jane

      You day her in your post so assuming you have a daughter, she’s gonna be one of those horrid, dispocable modern woman too you know. You’re raising one of those disgusting creatures and you can’t shield her from everything in society. In 20 years she’ll be one of us and tearing some poor sod down like your ex obviously did to you. Congratulations, you’re creating everything you claim to hate.

    • Kay

      I don’t know what the hell you went through the but bloody hell!! That kind of mind set will screw up your kid. You’re making it seem as though “modern women” are the Earth’s demon spawn. Just because the women you have interacted with, and observe in the media have values different then your own doesn’t mean that you should blacklist all modern women. Is that how you’ll see your own daughter when/if she hits the selfish/rebellious teenage phase? As another malignantly narcissistic sociopath? Because that is what will probably happen if you can’t see past such a poisonous outlook on women. I’m saying this as a Modern Woman who not only wants kids, but has helped raise several over the last 12 years. Maybe we were raised differently because of our culture but we were taught how to love (ourselves, and all others), something the women you’re describing don’t seem to know how to do. I do so hope that a better woman is placed in your path to show you how wrong you are. Not all women are so ruthless.

      • yessah3

        LOL! Yeah, he clearly has been through the ringer. I can honestly say my ex wife put me through hell in our 16 years together. I just got full custody of my oldest but still 50% custody of our youngest. She is a borderline/narcissist with plenty of issues that I could go into. The fact is I was nervous about dating again and letting someone into my life after her. I met a single mother who ironically has experienced the same type of abuse from her ex. We commiserate with each other and understand the dynamic and their traps and pitfalls that they create. Honestly, only someone who has been through what I have been through would work. Most would think I was paranoid or overreacting to my ex’s behaviors, but my ex is insidious and always does things for selfish self serving purposes. My girlfriend gets that and in fact will predict what my ex will do before she does it. We laugh about how crazy she is. Her ex is the exact same way. Moral of the story is that there are good apples out there. Don’t lose heart.

    • Dawn

      Please do women a favor and avoid us. I don’t date men with your attitude. Btw I’ve never done any of those horrible things you mention. However I have dated men (both dads and non dads)who apparently went through that (or are liars)and assumed women were like that. I have dated men who acted like that too so it’s not a one way thing. Sounds like you were rejected by a single childless woman and are angry she didn’t want you.

    • Summer

      Sometimes it’s just that the woman doesn’t want kids. Cool down.

    • cheeze.wiz

      We have no desire to meet you. So don’t worry

    • Isilzha

      With that attitude I hope you don’t have a daughter.

    • Sad for women

      Totally agree, I am same, full time single dad to two daughters, and yes I have dated women who all turn out to be selfish and narcissistic. I work hard and do ok, but not enough for them, really disillusioned with the modern western woman. I don’t let my thoughts be known to my own daughters and try to teach them to be kind, broadsided individuals. I have actually been amazed at what women say regarding love, money, etc, and what they do are almost complete opposites, and this applies to several women over many years.

    • Brittny Sanders

      HAhAHHAHAH with me I had this experience too BUT with GUYS. SO i have to agree that People in General are selfish when it does not benefit them and their selfish desires.

  • Brissa

    Sorry to hear that but there are some instances in which your partner has to come first, this applies even in marriages where its both biological parents. I’ve been fortunate enough that my partner understands this but we have differences in parenting cause his kids get away with everything and have no rules, meanwhile my biological child has to abide by the rules…which she’s old enough to understand isn’t fair. Aside from that I can say that there are certain instances in which he comes before my child, as my partner and man in my life. My child has her own place in my life and understands that I love her but it is importamd healthy to me for her to understand the dynamic between man/woman, within boundaries, so she has functional relationships when she becomes an adult. This is not to say I don’t value my child, rather I value her enough to tend a to my own happiness too.

    • yessah3

      Sorry, kids come first. Part of being a parent.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Sounds like an after school special

      • Jill

        Sorry, kids can’t always come fitst. Part of being a balanced, well rounded, decent human being.

  • Jody

    Funny. I work as a cousilor at a divore lawyer who only takes on mutual divorces (means he couple agrees on getting a divorce and how they want to arrange it. In my country you are obligated to get a lawyer and go trough court so hence the lawfirm I work at but technically there couples have it sorted out before they turn to us and we’re just here for the legal stuff, to help and give support).

    I’m well informed about pretty much every study and research on this subject and I can assure you every study done in the last 20 years in the USA and several European countries shows there are slightly more single women who are willing to date dads then there are single men who are willing to date mothers. The main reason these guys don’t want to date the singel mothers; they’ll never come first.

    Apparently the writer of this piece had a different experience but I would strongly suggest doing a bit more research on a subject before starting to spout void statements that are proven to be untrue. The double standard here is about 3% in favor of those singe dads so maybe you should take this piece down and re-write it so it fits reality.

    • Sled

      I disagree. And I’ve experienced both being a step dad and dating as a single father. How bout you?

      • Jody

        Disagree all you want. Facts are facts and there’s nothing you can do about it. This response just shows how petty guys are when they don’t get their way. Disagreeing with proven proven facts because the test results don’t suit you. Now that’s stupidity.

      • Sled

        Lol. You haven’t proven anything. But keep on trolling.

      • Jody

        Your kid being first in your life is absolutely fine. As I stated before, research shows there are more single women open to dating dads then there are single men willing to date mothers. Everyone can look it up. it is what it is.

        A stop sign is red and you can disagree all you want and call it yellow, it won’t change the fact that it’s red and you look like an idiot for not accepting that. It’s the same with this. Just because you don’t like the facts because it means you have to stop your little pity-party does not make them false.

      • Sled

        I tell you what, when you become a single father and experience it for yourself let me know.

      • yessah3

        Willing to date dads, but doesn’t necessarily mean OK with dad not putting them first correct? Using your example, red stop sign is there, everyone knows what it means, doesn’t mean everyone follows it. I think it could start out as they see a stable man who is willing to take care of someone other than himself. The thought of that they like probably because they see him as taking care of them or their own kids if they have more with him. I think many women will put up with a dad being dad to someone else’s kids for a while but most single women want to have a family of their own. I think this works both ways by the way. Personally I chose women who are in a similar situation, single moms. They at least get it. If you can’t make a date due to a school function or something kid related, they will understand. Plenty of single moms out there by the way.

      • Jody

        Honestly I think you’re right but as this article was about dating I felt it should at least be adressed that the author clearly didn’t do his research. But apart from that, I think you’re completely right that when that first thrill of being in love weares off a lot of childless/childfree people leave their childed partners because they made a miscalculation and aren’t that capable of dealing with it as they thought. It’s a very rough spot to be in and I think it’s very smart of you to date single moms.

      • Dawn

        That does make sense but I wonder why. I suspect it’s because women are given a harder time for not dating single dads and being single. I know several guys who don’t date single moms and no one bats an eye but they attack me for not dating dads.I’m told I should settle or that I’ll be alone and if those are my choices I take being alone. I have dated single dads and it was the worst experiences ever. The guys complaining are probably the same idiots who harassed me on dating sites and actually got one of my online profiles pulled because they didn’t like that I don’t date single fathers. My profile stated childless men only and they got butthurt. The guys who want childless women only mostly have sinister reasons why. It’s because a single mom will have her responsibilities as a mom. A childless woman will often have more time and more money and they want to tap into those.

    • Willy Donuts

      Can you cite those sources?

  • Sled

    Yup. I so agree with you, there is a double standard. And I raised two older brothers of my son for 15 years. I definitely wasn’t number one and didn’t expect to be. From step dad to single dad women sure are confusing. I’ve decided that my child is more important than dating. I’m not ruling anothing out, but I’m definitely not counting on it.

  • Dawn

    When single dads call childless selfish what they really mean is “she’s selfish because she doesn’t want to help support or babysit my kids”. Been there, done that, I’ve even been called selfish because I resented going on dates to McDonalds because that’s all he could afford. I’m no gold digger but it gets old fast if the new girlfriend only gets McDonalds while the ex was pursued by taking her to nice restaurants,

    • yessah3

      Maybe you feel like your value is the Ritz, but your real value is McDonald’s. I have met women like you who want a good looking guy who keeps in shape, makes lots of money and then gets mad when they can’t spend a lot of time with the family due to working so damn hard making that money and working out all the time to keep in shape. Lets face it most women are never satisfied or happy. I bett you have never loved anyone or anything unconditionally. Probably always strings attached. Sad.

      • Dawn

        No my value is the Ritz, not McDonalds. I don’t want any of that, though I don’t date obese men because I am not obese, I also don’t like men who are workaholics but yes would take them over a single dad. I have loved many and I love myself enough to know I deserve better than a single dad who expects me to help support the family I had no choice in having. You have a lot of assumptions about me that aren’t true. I am not a gold digger, I just don’t want to support the kids. It’s not my fault his marriage failed. I love unconditionally, including my animals. If anything it’s parents who don’t because many animals at animal shelters are there because the parents got bored with them. Same reason many get divorced, they get bored. I am far more responsible than that and I believe marriage is for life in most cases. Children deserve two parents.

      • yessah3

        You are very transparent. Guys see through women like you very quickly. The reason guys are “jerks” to you is that they immediately realize how shallow you are, realize there is no future with you, and so use you for sex. Then you wonder why they don’t cater to you or spend lots of money or time on you, because they don’t like you.

      • Dawn

        You’re funny, use me for sex? nope I don’t believe in sex before marriage, I didn’t say men are jerks I said you and your kind are jerks because I politely say no and your type harasses me. My profile stated “no dads” yet many guys still tried to persuaded me and got angry my no wasn’t changing. Men spend money on me, always have.

      • yessah3

        LOL! Oh wow, OK it is becoming crystal clear now. How about you put no sex before marriage on your posting too, and see how far that gets you. Your the funny one.

        By the way, my type would avoid you like the plague. You probably get the guys looking for quick hookup and sex. The dates don’t go past a few due to you not putting out.

      • Dawn

        Funny? nope religious and my religion prohibits sex before marriage. They also prohibit divorce in most cases. Men I date know this and guess what? I attract the cream of the crop,

      • yessah3

        Sure. Yet you are alone and single. Probably best. Still have the cats.

      • Dawn

        You sure know me, NOT. Actually I have a CAT not many and am not alone. You’re just jealous women with choices avoid you.

      • Jess

        Posts got out of control I think. cream of the crop? You just said how bad so many of your dates with men with children have been and you are single so your posts really have no merit. Not a bad thing to be single I’m just pointing out you contradict yourself constantly on here and it’s doubtful guys are knocking down your door to date you, because being of the mindset you are saying you are, you wouldn’t have bothered with a guy with a child. Cream of the crop doesn’t take you to mcdonalds either!

      • Dawn

        Actually those were single dads and nope they aren’t cream of the crop. The guys who take me to nice restaurants are childless. I do have men knocking down my door, having been a model and athlete. I’m single by choice because I am in love with someone but can’t be with him until he recovers from an illness. Just because I don’t date dads doesn’t mean I’m unwanted, I have many guys wanting to date me.

      • Tracy

        Wow. So you are a single father, and of a daughter? Please re read your posts to this woman, and imagine someone saying these things to your own little princess.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Life must be hard

      • bri

        Im a single dad i didnt choose this outcome however before this situation i have dated single mums and always been understanding and respectful thay childrens needs come first…ibe been a father figure for many years to other mens kids ..and thats fine since they arnt around anyway…however ibe found things to be very difgerent in the way that a woman sees a man with a child iys like they feel the need to compete with your child for yoir attention rather than wait ..also find a woman to even try dating when tjey know you have a child on yoir own…lol i wish all single dads out there the very best of luck however ive simply come to accept woman wont have me if i have my daughter. …ps i can go pick up any night as long as i dont mention i have a child….go figure….also im a working dad not a lazy stay at home on a pention like every single mum ibe ever met

      • cheeze.wiz

        Yes it’s all the woman’s fault that you have a baby mama… it’s not your child that’s the problem but you and her mother…ps I’m so tired of hearing how you’re not lazy because you work and take care of your kid.. You don’t get a pat on the back for not being a pos… You don’t what you should do… If you were out adopting a bunch of kids from terrible situations I’d say you were doing something with praise…

      • Roslyn Mendez

        I see what this is you’re a miserable little dick single father who is probably having a hard time saying because nobody wants to deal with you or your annoying children.

      • Dawn

        Yep. When I did date single dads the ones who only dated childless had the most entitled kids. Very few kids want to see their parents with other people outside of their mom.

      • cw

        So very freaking true! Most men date childless women by watching how their children will react to them. I COULDN’T have children, so you feel labeled or looked at like something is wrong with you or like you don’t like kids because you don’t have them. Like you said, few kids want to see their parents with other people. Especially if they are young kids.

      • Kimmy

        Are you or were you dating a widower?

    • randal

      I know this may sound far left….but most will say we date to marry…the reality is men really MARRY to DATE…You date one (1) woman for the rest of your life….as the vows state…If a man truly loves you the key ingredient is SACRIFICE…If there’s no sacrifice, love won’t exist there…

      • Dawn

        But if he has kids I’ll be the one sacrificing for him. I believe in one marriage (except for widowhood)the rest of my life and a guy who has either been divorced with kids or never married the mother isn’t for me. Men with kids date childless women because they seek someone to help support the kids, either financially or babysitting.

  • Summer

    I don’t date single fathers because I don’t want kids. EVER! Sometimes that’s all it’s about.

    • Dawn

      Exactly. I don’t have kids because I was always torn on that. I work with kids but as I get older I realize I am happier without kids. Instead the kids I work with are my kids. I’ve never been interested in raising someone else’s kids. In fact I never even babysat, no interest.

  • Evelyn

    I wouldn’t date single dads either if I were single. I just don’t find them attractive. Some woman love to see a man get all sweet and caring about his kids, I’m the opposite. I’m very traditional. A woman takes care of the household and the kids, a man works and takes care of the family by providing an income. A man doing household chores or taking care of kids is just a major turn-off and I don’t want to date someone if I don’t desire a sexual relationship with them as well.

    • randal

      You definitely shouldn’t date ANYONE you’re NOT ATTRACTED to…that would be utter stupidity…lol..

  • David

    Just read the comments below and can see how self-centered most women really are. Men who’ve stepped up to take full care of their children should be praised, it’s definitely tougher because the compassion to help them out just isn’t there from hardly anyone, I’ve been through it , I know…it’s a battle you are in daily for yourself and your child. Also men who’ve had to do this didn’t want it this way , obviously or they would have just left the mother to care but the opposite happened. Then we are looked down on “with baggage”…let a man say that about a single mother and see how he would be looked at. The hypocrisy runs deep with women. Also a man with this character does whatever it takes to take care of his loved ones , so what if he takes care of what women’s traditional values were supposed to be , that’s the cards he was delt, I’m sure he would rather be working to support his family and the mother/wife to be handling those things…how could that be a turn off? I think it just helps the women who make those comments sleep better at night for being so self centered/or they just plain can not understand because of the darkness of their hearts. I say Godbless the men who have put themselves 2cnd for bettering the lives of their children, Godbless!

    • Larissa

      Many single women take care of their kids and don’t expect a pat on the back like single dads do. But taking care of your kids doesn’t excuse you from putting effort into a relationship with a partner. Your kids have needs, you have needs and so does your prospective partner. Many single dads are looking for help. So before you go judge childless women for their views maybe you need to look at yourself.

    • Evelyn

      If you didn’t want to take care of kids on your own you shouldn’t have had them, period. When you had kids, it was a risk you took. Guess bitching about women not dating you and feeling like you deserve praise for doing what you’re supposed to be doing helps you sleep at night. At least you can just put the blame on evryone else this way so you don’t have to deal with the fact that you’re kids exsitence ruins your life and you really regret them being in this world and them being the cause of your loneliness. So much easier, just get angry at the people who can’t help what you did to yourself.

      • John

        I do want to take care of kids on my own and I was fully aware that my ex-wife could possibly flake on us, since so many women do. And I do a very fine job at parenting. My kids are much more fun to hang with than any woman.

      • Tracy

        Then simply don’t date! You guys with this type of attitude are killing me here. In your mind, you have obviously sealed your fate the minute you had children. So why are you even on this discussion and why are you trying to date any woman at all? As I posted on an above comment, you men have to realize that you are putting your kids first, but they will not always do the same for you. One day they will grow up and a part of their lives will not include you, just as you have done with your parents. You move on and start your own life eventually. And you will be home eating dinner alone, watching tv alone, going to bed alone. Kids only belong to us for so many years. The rest of your life after those years is a very long time to be lonely.

      • Dawn

        It’s because they think it makes them cream of the crop and since they believe they can have anyone they choose without kids. They never date single moms, just try us and get angry we turn them down.

    • Dawn

      Then date women with children. Most single dads think they are above single moms and get angry childless women don’t want them. Why single dads don’t get this is a mystery.

    • Isilzha

      So? That doesn’t mean anyone owes you a relationship. You do have baggage and no one is obligated to take that into their life.

    • Julie

      Maybe no one is showing you compassion because you don’t deserve any. Maybe you never thought about that because you’re too self-centered to realize you’re not doing anything special. Ever tought about that?

    • Lilly

      I’m sure someone who’s fat would eather be thin, I’m sure a guy with red hair would rather be blonde or dark, I’m sure an intelectually challenged person would rather be intellegent and have a college education. Would you date an addict, someone with a disability, someone with (visible) health issues? I bet you don’t so what’s wrong with you? Are you so dumb you just don’t get these were the cards those people got dealt or is your heart just that black? Do you tell yourself you’re just not attracted to these people to mask your selfishness and help you sleep at night? How can anything be a turn-off? Or does that little pity-party only apply when it’s convenient to you? Maybe you should rethink that comment about women being hypocrites.

  • Larissa

    I’m a childless woman and don’t date men with kids because I’m expected to make 95% of the compromises. Also when I try to discuss things my views are never validated and I was constantly ignored. Ignoring problems makes them worse not better. Both men and women with children like to complain that childless people don’t want to date them, but few are willing to work on their baggage. I’m sorry but if your kids sleep in your bed your not ready for a relationship. Also I don’t want a relationship with your ex wife. The less communication the less drama in my opinion. But many guys don’t allow you to have any say in how you want to manage that relationship. Like I said any relationship where one person does all the compromising won’t work. I was expected to change what I ate. They tried to tell me I couldn’t take a job where I would travel. Many didn’t want more children and lied to keep me. A childless woman is in high demand, I don’t have to settle for a guy who can’t manage his baggage. If you want a “unicorn” you are going to have to minimize your baggage. I’m not saying your kids aren’t a priority, I understand that but it doesn’t give you a free to pass to not disapline your children, manage your ex and make the childless person do all the compromising.

  • Summer

    How about everyone here just stop fighting and realize that maybe the woman doesn’t want kids and that’s why she doesn’t want to date a single father. It would be leading him on after all. That’s why I don’t. It’s not selfishness. She just doesn’t want kids.

  • Jill

    First of all, not one person in my friendgroup is willing to date a single parent. It’s not just the women but the guys as well and they use the same reasons the author called vile and immature. It’s fine if he feels that way but don’t just point at women but be fair and admit guys do and say the exact same things.

    Secondly, it’s not up to anyone to decide what criteria someone else can set for dating. It’s their life and they get to decide how they want to live it and who to share it with. If you call someone selfish for wanting certain things in a relationship everyone is selfish. Some people have higher standards, some people have different standards but that does not give you the right to judge. Just because you don’t mind, does not mean everybody has to be ok with it. It’s not just single parents that have a hard time dating. It’s also fat people, people with a disability, people with an illness and that list goes on and on.

    Lastly, I don’t date single dads. I have 2 great dreams in my life. Having a family and being an actrice. I got accepted at a great drama school and I decided not to go. I felt that, if I was to have a family, I should be financially stable and dramaschool is not the best way to get there. I gave up my big dream in order to make another dream come true. To have a family. To raise my kids in a nice big house, give them a college fund and give them the best start ever. So I went to law school. I hated it, but I did it to accomplish the most important thing in life. My own family. And now you’re saying I should just give that up and date someone whose been there and done that and whose financial situation will make most of my sacrifice for my future child completely void because he has other kids to care for and if I don’t I’m petty and selfish? You get back to me when you’ve worked your ass off for over a decade to realise a dream just to have someone tell you you’re not allowed to want what you want.

  • Hypocrites

    I don’t see anyone here saying they adopted their kids. Why didn’t you? Ow right, you didn’t even think about taking on someone else’s kids, you wanted YOUR OWN family and it didn’t involve non-biological kids. Guess what, that’s what I want too. But when you wanted it, that was fine but now someone else wants it, it’s selfish. Why? Because it doesn’t suit you and your wants? Cause that’s not a selfish attitide at all.

    • cheeze.wiz

      They all want a pat on the back for doing what people haves crumb doing sense the dawn of man. Losers

      • Dawn

        Exactly. I’ve had them even say they offered more than a childless man because they are raising their kids. Yes they offer more, they offer us the opportunity to help raise their kids (by babysitting and paying for them). No thanks, I’d rather buy my niece things or a guy I’m dating (and he can buy me things too).

  • John

    I am a single father, and let me tell you women that you are DAMN RIGHT that you will never come first. I had my kids before I met you, and they’ll still be my kids when you wake up with PMS and decide you’re not “fulfilled” with me anymore. They are children, and you are an adult. Grow up and take responsibility for your own happiness. Be sure to let me know how selfish you are up front, just so we won’t waste each other’s time. I’d 1000 X rather be alone with my kids than be with you.

    • Lilly

      I am an adult and I do take responsibility for my own happiness. I take care of myself and I entertain myself but I can do that whilst being single without the added stress of working around some other persons schedule. When I’m in a relationship I want a buddy, a partner in crime and an equal. Not the exact same thing I get when I’m single with the added stress of trying to match schedules. I prefer being alone to being with someone who can offer me only what a dad had to offer. I find it extremely childish to call people selfish because they won’t do what you want them to do. You’re absolutely right. Some people do need to grow up and stop throwing temper tantrums when they don’t get their way.

    • cheeze.wiz

      Don’t worry.. We aren’t knocking down your door… You’re not our type … We’d rather be alone and spend our money on investments… Hair bleach and travel than buying Christmas gifts for your kids because you have to pay child support

      • Dawn

        That’s partly why they seek us out. Been there, done that. Single parents want us for our money and our time babysitting. I once had a guy try to pull the fact he couldn’t buy me Christmas presents but expected me to buy his kids them. Instead, I dumped him. It’s my money and they aren’t my kids.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Totally… My ex used me to help support his kids while him and his ex provided them hardly anything.

      • Dawn

        Of course, that’s exactly why they seek us out. They look at us as having extra money and time and willing to share. The ex looks at our money as her money too and I know many exes who took the new love to court for her money. That used to be ridiculous but many judges are rewarding her the new wife’s money. Imagine that, a woman works hard and puts career before a family and when she finds a man who has kids and a lazy ex. Because neither one spent time developing a career due to kids they like the idea of the new woman supporting them and the kids because she has extra money. They assume we are desperate and they will con us. Then you have these articles telling us we need to pick these guys or we’ll be alone, or how wonderful they are. That’s because most are written by single parents and don’t want people to know it’s a scam.

      • cheeze.wiz

        I’m way happier alone than I ever have been dating haha

      • Dawn

        I don’t mind being alone and prefer it to a single dad.

      • Bobby Casey

        cheese.wiz, I have been wondering why you are on a parenting article bashing men..

        “Totally… My ex used me to help support his kids while him and his ex provided them hardly anything.”

        Ah, now I see.

        All you women are here to attack men you know nothing about because you met some losers…

        Seriously. You came here, to interrupt a forum that was supposed to be, I believe, about helping single fathers find peace with their problems.

        Instead all you people are on here, attacking fathers, saying, we deserve better than you and deal with it.

        Take your jaded punk hate out of here.

        “No one is knocking on your door”

        Who would want to date women that go on forums about fatherhood and insult men looking for answers?

        Sounds like a bag of crazy AF.

        No one. Single, or of the Dad variety.

      • Dawn

        Actually the article was bashing childless women who don’t date single fathers, telling us we need to lower our standards. People are knocking down my door to date me and single fathers love childless people because they have a babysitter or someone to help support their kids. Those of us without kids know this and we either decide to deal with it or not.

      • cheeze.wiz

        Or married

      • Dawn

        True, some are married too.

    • Tracy

      Just curious, but it sounds like you have your life completely fulfilled already. So then why date any woman at all? Its not even resaonable to say “date when your kids are older or moved out” because even then it doesn’t stop, it never stops and they will always be in your life. So with that type of attitude, you have guided your lifes path to remain single forever. And your children? They will marry, start a part of their lives that don’t include you, move on….. and you will be older, lonely, and stuck at home with your cats.

    • Dawn

      You sound like the typical butthurt single dads angry that women reject you. Yes, women with options (and those include their own money)won’t look twice at you. Many of us have dated men with kids and would rather not support your kids or babysit them since that is why men like you seek women like us.

    • Isilzha

      It’s one thing to understand you’ll never be first; it’s quite another to realize that he’ll never make you and your relationship a priority. He’ll talk you to death about taking trips but won’t ever take the effort to make arrangements. Hell, he couldn’t even tell me what day of the week he wouldn’t have the kids so we could make plans ahead of time. Yeah, I won’t waste my time with another single dad again.

      • Isilzha

        Exactly, I don’t think we’re under the illusion that we should come first all the freaking time, but they can plan a weekend away once in a while and they certainly should be able to plan for the week ahead without leaving you guessing about what day they’ll be available (or at all).

    • Isilzha

      Which is why we won’t date you.

  • Geena H

    No one should be shamed for having certain dating expectations. If you are not comfortable with dating a man with kids then be honest with yourself and don’t do it. I do notice there is a double standard when it comes to dating a man with kids though. I think this is because a lot of the times women are the primary care takers and have the power to dictate how the parenting interactions and relationship works. If your child’s mother is not over you and still wants you then chances are she will make it as hard as possible for you to be happy with someone else. Especially if the man is to afraid to stand up for himself. If you let her have that power she will use it. If you let her get away with doing petty things in order to keep the peace then you are letting her dictate and control how things run. Some men will let the mother push things as far as she can to avoid being put on child support and added drama. And it’s not always a problem with the child coming first, that’s how it should be. But no woman wants to feel like another woman is dictating her relationship.

    • Dawn

      I once dated a guy like that and never again. If I have a husband I don’t want another woman he was once involved with making rules.

  • Too early

    I’m 29 and I have to say, I’ve never met a single dad until a few days ago and he is well into his 40’s. In my experience most guys with a good education who come from decent families don’t start havig kinds untill they’re at least 35. If a guy has had kids by the time he’s 30 that rings alarm bells all over the place. Having kids before you’re at least 30 screams irrisponsible! For women over 40/45 the pickins might be a bit slimmer but for an educated woman from a good family, there’s plenty of options left after she turns 30.

    • Dawn

      Yeah the pickings are slimmer but I prefer being alone to being with a single dad. I don’t know if I would have alarms for a guy who had kids early unless he didn’t marry the mother or had been married several times. If I was going to date a single dad it definitely wouldn’t be a guy with out of wedlock kids or someone married several times.

  • Foster mom

    I’m a single mom of 3 (foster) children who live with me full-time and sometimes visit their parents. They may not be my biological kids but they are my children in every other aspect of life and I love them dearly. I’ve decided early on that I would never put a child on this planet while there were still children suffering from negelct or starvation and in need of a good home. I do my best to provide that home, give them what’s left of a nice childhood and save up some money so they have a little college fund or a down payment for a house or just plain party money when the time comes and they move out. I do everything a parent does + I deal with the damage the bio parents have caused and I do it on my own. I have NEVER, not once, felt I like deserve praise for this. I take care of my kids as a good parent should and that’s the normal way of things. The men here who write they deserve praise really sicken me. If you honestly feel you should be praised for something this basic, you realy shouldn’t be a parent. That entitled attitude is probably the reason they’re single, not their kids.

    Then there’s the issue of the double standard. There defenitely is one. Most single childless woman turn a guy with kids down relatively gently. The kind of things I’ve had yelled at me. I’m a whore, a slut, my utures is used up, my v. is too well traveled and stretched out. And when I tell the guys who said these things that my kids are foster children, I’m told I’m not a real woman for taking on some unwanted brats and I should send them back. I’ve been beaten up 3 times so far because I have my children. Pretty sure the men on here who feel like they have it rough haven’t had to deal with all of that crap.

    Most single dads won’t take me on either. 3 kids is too many, I’m not a real mom because my children are only foster kids. I’ve had a man tell me his daughter didn’t like mine so if we were to have a relationship I should sent the monster away and back into the hell hole where she came from (he literally said that!). If I like taking care of someone else’s kids so much, why didn’t I just get rid of those foster brats and take on his kids so his children would get extra attention? Trust me, single dads are just as selfish and dispicable a lot as the rest of us. Just because they take care of their own kids does not mean they’ll have any decency towards any other person in the world, I’ve learned it’s really pretty much the opposite. They talk the talk but when it comes to walking the walk they stumble, fall and demand you carry them. I’m sure there are exceptions but the ones I met are only interested in their own kids and won’t have anything to do with someone else’s.

    • cw

      I really commend you for that.

    • Dawn

      Foster mom, you are amazing and I think someone like you is to be commended. You made the choice to be a mom. I would date a guy with foster kids and even if he adopted. They choose to be dads and aren’t bitter like the other single dads. But yeah I am always polite when I turn down a guy, though my profile clearly states childless woman seeking childless man a few times. Sometimes I’ll get guys who will contact because they are the exception (widowers, adopted, etc)and I will consider them but the nasty ones by far are the single dads with exes. They are offended when I say thanks but no thanks. They are almost always guys with nasty profiles saying women are gold diggers etc. Who would want a guy like that? I’m polite and they go off on me. I’ve been called horrible names and even threatened.

      • Foster mom

        I really don’t understand why so many single parents are so angry people won’t date them. How can you expect someone to just be hapy to deal with the consequences of a decision you made before you met them? I think all single parents should just realise that any partner they date now will miss out on a lot and it is selfish to demand that of someone. I wouldn’t mind dating, though I have gotten a lot more careful for the sake of my kids, but if someone isn’t interested anymore after they find out about my children I don’t mind, as long as they let me know in a decent manner.

        I’ve never done the internet dating thing but I have noticed a lot of guys with exes are really nasty, especially the ones who now hate their ex. I always wonder, people don’t just change so if she’s such an awful psycho now, she was when you had kids with her and you still felt she would be a good mother for your children. Now what does that say about these men? And then they tend to take it out on other woman who had nothing to do with it.

        Everybody is free to make their own choices and as a single parent you can’t expect the whole world to change because you’ve gotten yourself in a less then perfect situation. I can inderstand how I have a relatively easy time at it because I made a thought out decision to be a single mom. I couldn’t find a man willing to take on foster children so I figured a one parent household would still be better then some orphanage and I took my kids in. I can understand how it must be a shock for people who had kids in a family setting and then got left with the kids, but that’s still no reason to feel so victimized and entitled. Life is hard sometimes, ask my kids. You have every right to decline and you’re not selfish or a bad person because of it!

      • Dawn

        If I’m understanding it, you adopted/fostered as a single mom, right? I ask because I have noticed a big difference between people who did this versus those who had kids with someone they aren’t with anymore. I would date a man who had kids in this situation because there’s no ex. The other situation is far more common.

        Anyway, the reason these men seek out childless/childfree women is because they expect more from us than we expect from them. In other words they want us because they assume we have extra time and money to dedicate to them, the kids and the ex. I’ve seen it countless times where a single dad wants to date me because I have relatively little baggage and he figures that since I’m older I’m desperate to accept scraps. I’m not and I won’t. These men never date single moms (yes I know some single dads date them but they aren’t the ones seeking women like me out). They in fact resent women, they claim their ex did them wrong (sometimes true, other times a lie).

        They seek out women like me to try to use and get angry they get rejected. My profile clearly stated no single dads (I would consider guys who are widowers or adopted as a single dad but rarely are they on dating sites). I got name called, I got threatened, I even had several guys report my dating profile to a dating site. They claim it’s discrimination but it’s not. I know why they are seeking me out, they are bitter men and angry someone like me doesn’t want their issues. I always hear the excuse that it won’t matter if he has a kid if we click. Sorry but when I meet a guy the first thing I ask him is if he has kids. If he says yes I’ll kind of ask if he fits in the category of widower or adoptive dad and he says no then I know he’s a definite no.

        I seem to find men with kids by different women, they are the worst. Why would they assume I would like them? I had an aunt block me on Facebook after I told her I had no interest in dating a guy with several kids by different women.

        I’m not casting judgment on these guys, I don’t want to date them. Very few women like me want to date them. They refuse to look at single moms (because they probably can’t give them time and money) and instead get angry when we say no. I am always polite, which is more than I have to be since they didn’t read my profile. They never are.

  • tayiah wattson

    People without children shouldn’t date people with kids period. Its not fair to the childless person when they enter into a relationship. I don’t know about anybody else but I always aim high for the best in life. People without children are the best ( from a childless persons point of view). They are the best because they typically have more time, economic resources, less stress/ drama. Its easier to build a family and wealth with them when all the economic wealth is concentrated on a single family unit and not spread out across town. You have a higher standard of living and quality of life.
    People man or woman don’t allow anyone to guilt you or shame you for having standards and wanting the best. Just because they screwd up.

    • cheeze.wiz

      Yes.. Preach

    • Lydia


    • Bobby Casey

      Screwed up? Better standard of living? Woah people. I agree that people without kids dating people without kids would have a lot of lifestyle things in common, but hate bashing parents like our lives are some how diminished or that we screwed up by choosing to be parents instead of having abortions..

      Wow. Have some issue with past BFs I see.

      I mean, you came to a post about Single Fathers to bash single fathers…

      Like.. this is how you spend all the amazing freedom? Being a troll?

      I’m regreting having a son, raising him to be a gentleman, being a loving father… when I could be single, trolling parenting sites, to insult people who are having problems that literally have nothing to do with me..

      Thats the real life.

      • Really?

        If you were married and your wife died that’s jut tough luck and I feel for you. If you wound up a single dad by any other way, you did screw up and you hurt your kid in the process. You don’t have children with someone you don’t know inside and out and if you know them well enough, you also know if they have the potential to walk out on you. You don’t have kids with someone like that. So either you didn’t know her well enough or you did but just couldn’t be bothered you find your child a decent mother.

        No one forced you to talk to the mother of your child, no one forced you to sleep with her. You don’t wind up pregnant by looking at someone and poof omg now the only options are having a kid or having an abortion. Most childless people are responsible enough to either practise abstinance of use birthcontrol so the option of abortion will never even need to be discussed. If you get to that point, you’ve already acted irrisponsibly.

        The person you commented on was right about the living standard. I want to have kids someday. If I do that with someone who doesn’t have any children yet, there will be more time, attention and money for our family then there would be if I were to have kids with someone who already has them and has to spread his time, energy and money around beteen more kids and maybe an ex. I know it’s not nice to hear but marrying someone without kids is a better guarantee of providing my future children with a better standard of living because resources won’t need to be spread around. I want a college fund for my kid, if there are no other kids, that’s no problem, if there are they sould be given the same thing and there goes my kids fund in half, a third, a quarter, depending on the amount of other kids. That’s just one example of a myriad of things that will lower the lifestandard of my kids if I were to have any with a single dad. That’s just reality.

        On top of that, and this is a selfish reason, I’ll give you that, I wouldn’t be able to enjoy my own pregnancy if I knew my husband has already gone through that with someone else. Being pregnant of a first child is, for many women the most special time in their lives and we want to share that with someone for whom it’s all new too. Not being able to do that ruins something that should be inportant, beautiful and special. It won’t be those things if the man already experienced it. It will be awkward, distressing and humiliating. I have a right to those 9 months and I have a right to experience that happiness. You don’t have the right to take that away from me.

        And no, I’m not here to deliberately bash single dads and if this were a place for single dads to talk about their hardships I’d keep my mouth shut and stay out of it. This is, however a blatand attack piece on women from a man that has written several articles that bash women and holds to a major double standard himself. Have you read his piece about men and single moms? If a guy doesn’t feel up to dealing with a womans kids that’s fine and he shouldn’t get into it! Then there’s this piece, if I don’t feel confortable dealing with a mans kids, well I’m just a horrible, childish, selfish brat. Just because I have different body parts I don’t have an obligation to just submit to any guy who demands that of me but that is the message the writer is sending in a lot of what he writes. I’m pretty sure that’s why so many women on here are responding. We’re not evil, we’re not out to bash single dads but we won’t sit idly by while we get bashed and villinized because we aren’t willing to give up what is extremely important to is for someone else’s kids.

      • Dawn

        Love your post! Exactly. I don’t hate single dads because they are single dads. What I hate is when I constantly tell them no and they call me names (like the guy who compared me to McDonalds) or when they want someone with time and money to help support their kids either financially or by babysitting. Single dads seek us out for a purpose and most of us know it. Sure, there are cases where this clicks but most of the time it’s a single dad on a dating site butthurt because I rejected him (though he rejects single moms).

      • Really

        Exactly. My brother is a single dad too. His wife died giving birth to my nephew so he was left to care for 2 young children. He doesn’t date because he knows he won’t be able to model a normal, healthy relationship and be a good parent. He tells my niece and nephew how he treated their mother. How she was the most important person in his life and how he cherished and cared for her and he hopes his son and daighter will grow up knowing they deserve to be their spouses priority and how to make their spoise their priority.

        My brother told me a while ago, if a parent wants to date, they’re not doing their job because they’re either going to neglect the children or they’ll model an unfair relationship which will taint any relationship the kids will have in the future. When a parent says they want to date but my kids come first what they mean is, I come first and I use my kids as an excuse to have a partner but not be one and I don’t care how that affects the future of my child, nor the happiness of said partner.

        There are plenty of decent single parents out there but you’re not going to meet them on dating sites or webpages like this one. On the internet it’s mostly frustrated, lonely, angry people who first care for themselves and use theis kids as an excuse for pretty much everything. When someone starts calling you selfish or calls you names, it’s a pretty clear sign that staying away from them was the best course of action. And you’re right those are usually the guys who won’t date a single mother. Especially the divorced ones because they only have their kids every other weekend of during school holidays so why get stuck with another mans child all the time. Well, newsflash, I don’t have a kid at all so why get stuck with one every other weekend of during school holidays?

      • Dawn

        Your brother sounds like the type of single dad I would date because he has his life together and lost his wife due to death. I have noticed that men like him aren’t on dating sites for the most part. Instead, it’s divorced or never married dads who are bitter their wife left him or got pregnant. The sane single dads are busy raising their kids to care about dating, then date when the kids are grown. Those aren’t the guys who usually contacted me. Sometimes I would get a single widowed dads, or a dad with grown kids or guys raising kids they adopted but usually these guys are too busy doing other things. The majority were guys without children all the time. They were paying child support (or were supposed to)and were bitter that I didn’t have any children to support and didn’t want to support theirs. I would easily say 90% of the dads on dating sites would contact because of wanting to use me, nothing more. If they truly wanted a relationship they would contact others. On top of it so many asked me to give them money! Yeah right.

      • Really?

        I know, that’s a massive issue. Most of the divorced guys feel like their too good to date a single mom but go absolutely haywire when a childless person won’t date them. Talk about a double standard. Even the original author of this piece wrote that his friend dates plenty as long as he sticks to other single parents. Is these single or divorced dads would just wait till the kids are grown or date single mothers they wouldn’t be so lonely and they wouldn’t be trolling the internet trying to bully women into doing something they don’t want to do.

        I have absolutely no issue with someone being a single parent. I have no issue with them contacting me. I have a major issue with them not taking no for an answer. I have a major issue with the ones who won’t look after another mans child but who do feel entitled to burden me with another womans child. I have a major issue with the ones who act like their life is so tough. Thank god my brother realised he chose to have his kids so everything that came after that was his own doing instead of moving into sulking-mode like most guys here.

      • Dawn

        I agree. I am accused of hating single parents but that’s not the issue. What is the issue is the fact that my profile stated “no dads” and they got offended. I’m a brunette, I wouldn’t respond to an ad that says “blondes only”.

      • Really

        Exactly. If you don’t fit into someones preferred profile, let it slide and move on.

        And those dads can be really tricky, even offline. I dated my ex-boyfriend for almost 2 months before he finally came out saying he had a kid and she spends most time with her mother. Even then he told me because I thought it odd he could only meet up every other weekend. Third time he was finding excuses to not date that weekend I caught on and confronted him. He already thought I wouldn’t want him if I knew about his child so he just didn’t tell me and he hoped that, by the time he did tell, I’d be so invested in him and us I’d let it slide. Needless to say, the kid wasn’t the only reason I left him. What kind of parent does that? Tricking someone into dating them knowing full well that person doesn’t want their kid around and will probaly resent the situation? That’s harmful for the child as well.

      • Dawn

        I’ve had that happen too, where they share that after the fact. It’s why when I meet a guy i really ask because I’d hate to find out a guy I liked had kids. I don’t get why they want us, but yeah they do and it’s due to money or babysitting. Otherwise they wouldn’t lie or wouldn’t get offended when we say no.

      • Dawn

        Many of us wouldn’t give single fathers a thought if your kind didn’t try to date us then get mad because we don’t like the lifestyle. We wouldn’t be posting us these sites if they didn’t keep posting ideas telling us to lower our standards for them, while at the same time telling men not to date single mothers.

    • Dawn

      Agreed. I made sure I didn’t have kids with a guy i knew wouldn’t be forever, I don’t want my money to go towards them.

  • Daddy Warbucks

    To be a successful single father you have to think and act fast. Your planning needs to be dialed. And when those plans derail you need to have plan b, c, d, etc..
    How can you care about frivolous ventures when you forgot to re-up and your down to the last baby wipe. The best thing for your children is to make sure your healthy. Your the last line of defense, the buck stops here. Your health is one thing you have slight control of barring act’s of god.
    So for a female to gain my attention she would have to be something truly special. Have you tried talking to a single person with no kids? It can be awfully boring. About 85% of the time I start to feel awful for them. They remind me of animals in the shelter. Just meeting random people who have no intentions of giving them a home, grasping for love before they get put to sleep. Its funny how non-spawns comments and remarks on relationships are eerily similar to views of sociopaths and narcissists.
    So when you find that person start small. Honestly your only going to have time for short conversations. But fear not, that is how the seeds of friendship is sown. Use those tiny conversations as a peep hole to the inner you. 23 hours and 48 minutes we have are dad pajamas on, but for two minutes take them off and don’t talk about your kids. Two minutes over the course of a year adds up for someone to get to know you. Real friendships span lifetimes and real relationships stem from the foundation of BFF’s.
    If your looking to satisfy physical needs just lower your standards. Just bang ol mcdonalds dawn. She don’t know shit from Shinola. And at least your kids will get a present before you curb her ass. And you’ll teach your kids a valuable lesson: How to take out the trash 101.
    Ok that was rude, I apologize dawn. Sounds like you went a few rounds with a narcissist. My heart goes out to ya, I know that angry place and I wouldn’t want that to happen to my daughter. It is a slippery slope narcissist make narcissist. You’ll never be able to fill that void in your heart. But ya can’t say nobody told ŷa.

    • Foster mom

      So you aren’t capable of checking your stock before going to the store and forget something pretty essential which later becomes a problem you then have to solve, i.a. you have a total lacl of planning potential.

      You feel better then a lot of other people simply because you have kids and therefore refuse to show an interest in anyone else except yourself and your kids and you expect the whole world to adjust to that. You even compare people to animals that are going to be put down if they don’t have kids. Is that what you’ll teach your own children. If they choose not to have kids someday or if they can’t, that they are disposable and should just be killed as pathetic muts?

      And you’re teaching your kids woman are disposable. Do you have a daughter? At least you’ll make a lot of men happy by teaching her to spread her legs for everyone who asks and then be discarded. That’s what daddy did with his woman.

      Amazing bit of parenting right there. I’m sure those children will grow up into fine adults (as long as they’re taken away by foster care on time)

      • Dawn

        He reminds me of the mentality that most single dads have online who contact me. Almost all of them think they are doing me a favor by contacting, because after all I’ll be alone. Then when I reject they call me names like McDonalds Dawn. They think I’m so desperate to be a mother and I’ll think it’s an honor to date them. I know they seek out childless to help support their kids. The irony is most are unattractive and poor to boot. Yeah, an educated former model is so desperate to date an overweight misogynist.

      • Dr. Batman NASA PhD

        “An educated former model” watch out guys we have a badass in here!

        Dawn, as you can plainly see above, I am a doctor. I have a PhD in Rocket Surgery and a 17 inch penis. The oath I took at Rocket Surgery School prohibits me from lying, so that when combined with my prestigious medals awarded by the King of Zamunda for candor and honesty–show that you can trust that I am who I say I am.

        I like to spend my days relaxing on my multi-zillion dollar yacht–because I fight crime and evil-doors at night. Because of all of these awesome FACTS about me, I feel that I am in a unique position to comment on your post.

        I feel that the evildoers who are insulting an upstanding former-model like yourself should be dealt with harshly! If the movie Zoolander taught us anything, it is that former models are super important and so let me be the first to say that I support all of your decisions and hold “educated former models” in high regard!

        When I think of all of the people that have a rough life–educated former models comes to mind! I can’t explain how much you posting on this board means to all of our citizens unworthy of your company–including “single fathers” “poor” “unattractive” and “overweight.”

        I am so sorry that an educated former-model like yourself has suffered the indignity of being contacted by a poor person, or someone that is unattractive!

      • Really

        She doesn’t have an issue with those guys contacting her. She, as do most single childless women, has an issue with the harassment that follows when she politely declines to date a single father. Someone like you is the perfect example of how pathetic these guys can get while they, at the same time outright refuse to date a single mother.

      • Dawn

        Exactly. I understand I will be contacted by men I have no interest in. That happens and what I don’t like may appeal to someone else. What i don’t like is that my profile clearly stated several times “childless woman seeking childless man” or “no kids please” and yet they contact and when I politely tell them no or ignore them I get a blistering, nasty email. Most of them state no single moms yet get mad when we reject. That makes them hypocrites.

      • hiiii


    • cheeze.wiz

      Haha haha

      Oh you’re serious

    • Dawn

      I’m not McDonalds Dawn and I don’t want or need your sympathy. I refuse to lower my standards and dating a single dad means dating from the bottom of the barrel. You should have stayed with the mother of your children and if that doesn’t work then seek out single moms and not women who don’t want your children.

      • Isilzha

        Why is it that so many men think women OWE them?

      • Dawn

        I wish I knew. What I don’t get is my profile clearly stated “no dads” yet they contacted me. At first I was polite (which is more than they deserved)but they didn’t get the hint and then got mad. They figured that if they were nice at first I would change. I never did and they got mad. These same guys think single moms are damaged goods but think we want them and they deserve a childless woman. I don’t get it. Then you have people who tell us we are wrong for not dating single dads because we have to lower our standards.

  • Chris

    Right…there is something here that some people are having difficulty understanding… As I single dad I am not looking for someone for their money. Or for them to babysit. Nor am I looking for another mother for my children. It is very simple. I am looking for an opportunity go to a nice restaurant as part of a night out (not on my own or with kids). I would like a reason to buy flowers or get excited about Valentines day. I have a lot to offer and wish to find someone to share it with. Not everyone approaches potential relationships just thinking about what they can get out of them for themselves.

    • Julie

      You sound like a nice, balanced guy and I understand where you’re coming from and you deserve to have those things. I don’t think any of the women here are going into a relationship thinking only of what they can get out of it but it isn’t rational to believe that someone is going to start a relationship without also thinking about the implications for themselves. I do believe that many single parents (not just dads) use their kids as an excuse to not put their fair share of effort into the relationship. And at the end of the day, when someone childless enters a relationship with a single parent they are going to be spending their time and money on someone else’s child. That might not be what the parent wants to date for but it will happen, especially if you move in together or get married.

      What angered me personally was that most guys on here aren’t even willing to consider what their children mean for a potential partner. You’ve had a long time together with you ex without kids to form a bond. You’ve got to marry someone who was new to it and for whom it was exciting the same way it was for you. You got to experience having your first child with someone for whom it was all new as well. And now many guys are turning around and saying: “well I’ve had those things that you’ve been dreaming of your whole life but you don’t deserve them even though I did and if you want them you’re selfish. You’ll just have to accept that those things will be less special for you, with the shadow of an ex looning over it all, and dealing with a partner for whom it’s not so exciting because he’s been there and done that because of decisions he made and you had no say in”. I and any person in the world, deserve a fresh start as much as the next person even though many single parents apparently feel we don’t.

      That doesn’t mean that I don’t think about what I have to offer someone else and that doesn’t mean that I don’t dream of taking care of a man, trying to make him happy and give him a clean and nice home to go to after work. I want to cook, clean, give my future husband a child, put a little note in his lunchbox in the morning when he’s going to have a long day, make sure I stay as pretty and thin as possible so he can keep showing me off, work part-time and bring in some money myself to relieve the pressure on him of being the provider, I want to support him in whatever he does and show him he’s the most important person in the world every single day. I speak 4 languages (though admittey my writing can be off) I knit, I saw, have a college education, play the piano and violin, I can sing, I can cook and bake and have an extensive knowladge of music and art. My parents, and when I got older I myself, have put a lot of time and effort into making me a perfect wife for a man who can appreciate these things. But at the end of the day a relationship is something you do together, it’s a 50/50 situation and a man should treat me right too. And in my case that entails being his first wife and being the only mother of any children he might ever have and honestly, I don’t think that’s such a bad trade-off for what I want to give him.

  • Robert

    Did you know that children of divorced or seperated parents do worse at school and need more attention? That costs society money. Did you know that children who are in the same classroom as kids of divorced parents do worse at school? That costs society money as well. How many kids are going to be in you childrens classes during their school going years. I’d say a few hundred, spread out over elementary, middle and highschool. A few hundred lives negatively impacted by your choice to have those kids of yours.

    These kids are going to grow up. They’re going to have a lesser education than they could have had so they’re going to earn less. They’ll get married so add another few hundred lives negatively impacted by your kids. They’ll have kids themselves who will live in poorer conditions then they could have so I’m pretty sure we’re nearing a thousand lives negatively impacted by 1 kid now. That’s billions of dollars society as a whole loses over you jumping in the sack with the wrong person. Woth that kind of money we could find a cure for cancer or HIV or we could solve a massive part of the famine in Africa. But no, let all those people starve to death because my 1 kid brings me happiness and that is so much more important then all these human lives.

    And yet you’re on here saying you’re an amazing guy for taking care of that burden on society that causes all that pain and misery and you’re even angry that people don’t want to date you. Rhe negative impact your kid has on society is going to spread like an oilstain over the world long after your kid has died of old age and you want to drag even more people into it?

    How dare you call anyone selfish after what you caused?

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